17 points of the True Church

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Mittens
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17 points of the True Church

Post by Mittens »

17 Points of the One True Church

1. The one true church must teach that only ONE god exists (Deut. 4:35,39, Deut. 32:39, 1 Kings 8:60, Isa. 43:10, Isa. 44:6,8, Isa. 45:5,21,22, Isa. 46:9, Mark 12:32, 1 Cor. 8:4, etc.

2. The one true church must teach that salvation is “not by works” (Eph. 2:8-9, Tit. 3:5, 2 Tim. 1:9, Rom. 4:1-5, Rom. 11:5,6. etc. etc.)

3. The one true church must teach that the time of “prophets” has ended, and we are under the leadership of Jesus Christ (Heb. 1:1-2).

4. The one true church must teach that church elders must be married, with children, older and mature, and demonstrate an ability to teach (Tit. 1:5-8, 1 TIm. 3:2)

5. The one true church must teach that church deacons must be married, with children, older and mature (1 Tim. 3:12)

6. The one true church must teach that God is invisible (Col. 1:15, 1 Tim. 1:17, Heb. 11:27)

7. The one true church must teach that God is spirit (John 4:24).

8. The one true church must teach that God is not a man (Job 9:32, Num. 23:19, 1 Sam. 15:29).

9. The one true church must teach that humankind are CREATIONS of God, not “children” of God (Gen. 1:27, Gen. 5:1, Isa. 64:8, Mal. 2:10).

10. The one true church must teach that redeemed saints BECOME children of God through ADOPTION (Rom. 8:15, Gal. 4:5, Eph. 1:5).

11. The one true church must pray to Jesus Christ (Acts 7:59, John 20:28).

12. The one true church must be willing to financially support those devoted to ministry (Luke 10:2-7, 1 Cor. 9:7-14, 1 Tim. 5:17-18).

13. The one true church must compare all new claims of revelation with the Bible and reject whatever disagrees ((Gal. 1:8, 1 Thess. 5:21, Acts 17:11, 2 Tim. 3:16).

14. The one true church is that which was established by Jesus, has never been overcome, but has existed on the Earth throughout all generations since Jesus (Matt. 16:18, Eph. 3:21).

15. The one true church must not make the issue of what we eat or drink a requirement of the gospel (Mark 7:18-20, Rom. 14:14-18, Col. 2:13-17).

16. The one true church must teach that God has been God from all eternity (Ps. 90:2, Mal. 3:6, James 1:17).

17. The true church must teach that God does not have a physical body (John 4:24, Luke 24:39, 1 Kings 8:27, John 1:18, 1 Tim. 1:17).
Last edited by Mittens on Fri Sep 27, 2019 2:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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moksha
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Re: 17 points of the True Church

Post by moksha »

Mittens, these seem like unusual checklist items for an exorbitant claim. Are these the tenets of a faith tradition you have joined?
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Re: 17 points of the True Church

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Every religion says they're the true one. They each have their holy books and revelations, their holy buildings and traditions. Religion has often been used to conquer and colonize and control other people and religions notoriously split from each other and fight each other--just like ordinary humans do. A "true church" is still a false reality invented by humans who pretend they are gods or talk to god. It is especially useful in giving people of low self esteem a feeling of superiority. This is an illusion that depends on remaining in a cult-like situation to maintain. You may enjoy your opiate of the masses but you are unable to live without it--that's how opiates are: addictive things which depend on others to obtain, that can overwhelm your whole life and drive your family away. Didn't Jesus say that those who would not leave their families for him were not worthy of him? Cult leader. Drug dealer.
"God" is the original deus ex machina. --Maksutov

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Re: 17 points of the True Church

Post by Mittens »

moksha wrote:Mittens, these seem like unusual checklist items for an exorbitant claim. Are these the tenets of a faith tradition you have joined?


This is the list of my Churches tenants

https://i.imgur.com/lS6Tti8.jpg
Justice = Getting what you deserve
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Maksutov
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Re: 17 points of the True Church

Post by Maksutov »

Mittens wrote:
moksha wrote:Mittens, these seem like unusual checklist items for an exorbitant claim. Are these the tenets of a faith tradition you have joined?


This is the list of my Churches tenants

https://i.imgur.com/lS6Tti8.jpg


Do they include all the Commandments?
"God" is the original deus ex machina. --Maksutov

Ceeboo
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Re: 17 points of the True Church

Post by Ceeboo »

Hey Mittens
Mittens wrote:17 Points of the One True Church

1. The one true church must teach that only ONE god exists (Deut. 4:35,39, Deut. 32:39, 1 Kings 8:60, Isa. 43:10, Isa. 44:6,8, Isa. 45:5,21,22, Isa. 46:9, Mark 12:32, 1 Cor. 8:4, etc.

2. The one true church must teach that salvation is “not by works” (Eph. 2:8-9, Tit. 3:5, 2 Tim. 1:9, Rom. 4:1-5, Rom. 11:5,6. etc. etc.)

3. The one true church must teach that the time of “prophets” has ended, and we are not under the leadership of Jesus Christ (Heb. 1:1-2).

4. The one true church must teach that church elders must be married, with children, older and mature, and demonstrate an ability to teach (Tit. 1:5-8, 1 TIm. 3:2)

5. The one true church must teach that church deacons must be married, with children, older and mature (1 Tim. 3:12)

6. The one true church must teach that God is invisible (Col. 1:15, 1 Tim. 1:17, Heb. 11:27)

7. The one true church must teach that God is spirit (John 4:24).

8. The one true church must teach that God is not a man (Job 9:32, Num. 23:19, 1 Sam. 15:29).

9. The one true church must teach that humankind are CREATIONS of God, not “children” of God (Gen. 1:27, Gen. 5:1, Isa. 64:8, Mal. 2:10).

10. The one true church must teach that redeemed saints BECOME children of God through ADOPTION (Rom. 8:15, Gal. 4:5, Eph. 1:5).

11. The one true church must pray to Jesus Christ (Acts 7:59, John 20:28).

12. The one true church must be willing to financially support those devoted to ministry (Luke 10:2-7, 1 Cor. 9:7-14, 1 Tim. 5:17-18).

13. The one true church must compare all new claims of revelation with the Bible and reject whatever disagrees ((Gal. 1:8, 1 Thess. 5:21, Acts 17:11, 2 Tim. 3:16).

14. The one true church is that which was established by Jesus, has never been overcome, but has existed on the Earth throughout all generations since Jesus (Matt. 16:18, Eph. 3:21).

15. The one true church must not make the issue of what we eat or drink a requirement of the gospel (Mark 7:18-20, Rom. 14:14-18, Col. 2:13-17).

16. The one true church must teach that God has been God from all eternity (Ps. 90:2, Mal. 3:6, James 1:17).

17. The true church must teach that God does not have a physical body (John 4:24, Luke 24:39, 1 Kings 8:27, John 1:18, 1 Tim. 1:17).


Wow - This sounds like a very special church!

I know it would be almost impossible to compete with a 17 point spectacular church like this - but I do want to give you a mere 3 points for you to weigh and measure against this marvelous organization you provided.

1. Jesus was crucified.
2. Jesus rose from the dead.
3. Jesus is God.

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Re: 17 points of the True Church

Post by Mittens »

https://i.imgur.com/lS6Tti8.jpg

Do they include all the Commandments?

Does The Mormon Articles of Faith include the Commandments ?

:lol:
Justice = Getting what you deserve
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Maksutov
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Re: 17 points of the True Church

Post by Maksutov »

Do they include all the Commandments?

Does The Mormon Articles of Faith include the Commandments ?

:lol:

That's a different question, isn't it? Are you afraid to answer what I asked?
"God" is the original deus ex machina. --Maksutov

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Re: 17 points of the True Church

Post by huckelberry »

Maksutov wrote:
Mittens wrote:This is the list of my Churches tenants

https://i.imgur.com/lS6Tti8.jpg

Do they include all the Commandments?

I am a little confused by this question. All I find with the link is one page statement with a short paraphrase of apostles creed with a new opening statement about the inerrancy of scriptures, nothing about commandments.

Though there could be some important questions about inerrancy and commandments.

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Re: 17 points of the True Church

Post by huckelberry »

If mittens is speaking of a one true church perhaps there should be clarification of inerrancy of scripture.

"Believe the Bible is the word of God fully inspired and without error in the original manuscripts. Written under the inspriation of the Holy Spirit and having supreme authority in matters of faith and conduct."

Conduct is the subject of commandments. Consider ," remember the sabbath day and keep it holy." Is it important to do no work on Saturday?

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Re: 17 points of the True Church

Post by huckelberry »

I am puzzled about the specification of r original manuscripts for inerrancy. We have no original manuscripts. There is plenty of reason to wonder what relationship our manuscripts have to the original. The versions of Torah we have are hundreds of years after Moses. Have you ever considered whether some of the ugly rules in there are uninspired additions made over the centuries? Well there is no way to be sure about that so we are pretty much stuck following rules that make sense to us and skipping ones like " thou shalt not suffer the witch to live"which have proven very destructive.


If you are unwilling to kill witches it seems questionable that you really believe in inerrancy of scripture.

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Re: 17 points of the True Church

Post by Mittens »

huckelberry wrote:If mittens is speaking of a one true church perhaps there should be clarification of inerrancy of scripture.

"Believe the Bible is the word of God fully inspired and without error in the original manuscripts. Written under the inspriation of the Holy Spirit and having supreme authority in matters of faith and conduct."

Conduct is the subject of commandments. Consider ," remember the sabbath day and keep it holy." Is it important to do no work on Saturday?


The LORD'S DAY has replaced the Sabbath :lol:
Justice = Getting what you deserve
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huckelberry
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Re: 17 points of the True Church

Post by huckelberry »

Mittens wrote:
huckelberry wrote:If mittens is speaking of a one true church perhaps there should be clarification of inerrancy of scripture.

"Believe the Bible is the word of God fully inspired and without error in the original manuscripts. Written under the inspriation of the Holy Spirit and having supreme authority in matters of faith and conduct."

Conduct is the subject of commandments. Consider ," remember the sabbath day and keep it holy." Is it important to do no work on Saturday?


The LORD'S DAY has replaced the Sabbath :lol:


That sounds like saying the Roman Catholic church has authority over scriptures. (not an unreasonable position but perhaps not completely accurate)

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Re: 17 points of the True Church

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The LORD'S DAY has replaced the Sabbath :lol:

That sounds like saying the Roman Catholic church has authority over scriptures. (not an unreasonable position but perhaps not completely accurate)

Sounds like Mormonism :lol:
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Re: 17 points of the True Church

Post by huckelberry »

mittens wrote:
huckelberry wrote:That sounds like saying the Roman Catholic church has authority over scriptures. (not an unreasonable position but perhaps not completely accurate)

Sounds like Mormonism :lol:

Perhaps I should have been clearer. There is no change of the sabbath to Sunday in scripture. The change was made by the Catholic church, made official in the fourth century. This was done by both church authority and the authority of the emperor.

If you want to go by scripture it would appear you should observe a scriptural sabbath, Friday sunset to Saturday sunset as is done by Seventh day Adventists. (and Jews)

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Re: 17 points of the True Church

Post by Mittens »

On what day did the early church meet for worship? Scripture never mentions any Sabbath (Saturday) gatherings by believers for fellowship or worship. However, there are clear passages that mention the first day of the week. For instance, Acts 20:7 states that “on the first day of the week we came together to break bread.” In 1 Corinthians 16:2 Paul urges the Corinthian believers “on the first day of every week, each one of you should set aside a sum of money in keeping with his income.” Since Paul designates this offering as “service” in 2 Corinthians 9:12, this collection must have been linked with the Sunday worship service of the Christian assembly. Historically Sunday, not Saturday, was the normal meeting day for Christians in the church, and its practice dates back to the first century.

The Sabbath was given to Israel, not the church. The Sabbath is still Saturday, not Sunday, and has never been changed. But the Sabbath is part of the Old Testament Law, and Christians are free from the bondage of the Law (Galatians 4:1-26; Romans 6:14). Sabbath keeping is not required of the Christian—be it Saturday or Sunday. The first day of the week, Sunday, the Lord's Day (Revelation 1:10) celebrates the New Creation, with Christ as our resurrected Head. We are not obligated to follow the Mosaic Sabbath—resting, but are now free to follow the risen Christ—serving. The Apostle Paul said that each individual Christian should decide whether to observe a Sabbath rest, “One man considers one day more sacred than another; another man considers every day alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind” (Romans 14:5). We are to worship God every day, not just on Saturday or Sunday.
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Re: 17 points of the True Church

Post by moksha »

Mittens wrote:The LORD'S DAY has replaced the Sabbath :lol:

Officially, the Jewish Sabbath was discontinued by order of Emperor Constantine to be replaced by Mithra's Day. Since the new Lord's Day was also Sunday, it replaced Mithra's Day when Christianity became dominant.
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Re: 17 points of the True Church

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Mittens. the approach to Sabbath which you posted is the way I view it so any discussion further is not a disagrement about that. I live in an area with quite a few Seventh Day Adventists. I am familiar with their views (some are stricter than others) I just do not share them. It is an illustration of how different groups can take scripture and arrive at different conclusions. It can be observed in the past there has been quite a tradition of strict Sunday Sabbath observance. America has had laws in the past enforcing some Sabbath observance on Sunday. These are pretty much all gone now. I think that over the centuries people have thought about how to best keep some spirit of the Sabbath commandment. There is variety in how that works out.

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Re: 17 points of the True Church

Post by DRLehrer »

Gee, I found a list of 20 points of the true church, and they are different, although also based entirely on scripture:

THE TWENTY POINTS OF THE TRUE CHURCH

Teachings of the True Church:

1. There will be no physical, visible coming of the Kingdom of God (John 18:36, Luke 17:21).
2. The celebration of the Lord's supper includes bread, wine (Matt 26:26-29) and the washing of each others' feet (John 13:4-15).
3. Marriage and divorce are frowned upon (1 Cor 7, Matt 19:9, Mark 10:2-12).
4. The Jewish Temple ritual will be observed (Acts 2:46).
5. The Church takes priority over family (Luke 14:26, 12:51-53, Matt 10:21).
6. Women must cover the head while praying (1 Cor 11:5-10).
7. Eunuchs will have special respect in the Church (Matt 19:12).
8. Only two commandments: Love God and love thy neighbor (Matt 22:36-40).

Members of the True Church can be recognized by the following:

9. They hold all things in common ownership (Acts 2:44-45).
10. They do not sin (1 John 3:6-9).
11. They can drink poison without harm (Mark 16:18).
12. They do not strike back if you strike them (Matt 5:39).
13. If you ask to borrow anything from them, you do not have to return it (Luke 6:30).
14. They never have to hire movers or earthmoving equipment, or use UPS; they can literally move anything by the power of God (Matt 17:20, 21:21, Mark 11:23).
15. They have no retirement plans, savings account, or food supplies stored away (Matt 6:25-34). And no possessions (Matt 19:16-21, Mark 16:21, Luke 18:22).
16. They never pray in public (Matt 6:5-8).
17. They are like sheep or children (Matt 19:14, 18:3-4, Mark 10:15, John 10:2-27, Heb 13:20).
18. They do not go to a doctor when ill, but heal each other with prayer (James 5:13-15, Mark 16:18).
19. Their children are not rebellious; they kill them if they are (Matt 15:3-9).
20. They do not die (John 8:51, 11:25-26).

Why is your list better than mine?

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Re: 17 points of the True Church

Post by LittleNipper »

Maksutov wrote:Do they include all the Commandments?

The true CHURCH (meaning the body of all saved born again believers -- past, present and future) realizes that Jesus fulfilled every requirement of the Commandments. Now our trust is in HIM and not our ability to keep the impossible. The Holy Spirit now works with the save individuals to conform them to be more and more like Christ and strive to keep HIS commandments, though imperfectly, yet perfected when viewed through the blood atoning work of Jesus.
Last edited by LittleNipper on Sat Oct 19, 2019 7:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 17 points of the True Church

Post by moksha »

Just thought Allen Wyatt or other interested individuals should know that the name Subjectively True Church is up for grabs.
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