Interpreter's "Witnesses" Film Threatens to Overtake the FAIR Mormon Conference

The catch-all forum for general topics and debates. Minimal moderation. Rated PG to PG-13.
_moksha
_Emeritus
Posts: 22508
Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 8:42 pm

Re: Interpreter's "Witnesses" Film Threatens to Overtake the FAIR Mormon Conference

Post by _moksha »

Sort of a shame the props people could not find a white stovepipe hat for historical accuracy.

https://wp-media.patheos.com/blogs/site ... .13-PM.png
Cry Heaven and let loose the Penguins of Peace
_Dr Exiled
_Emeritus
Posts: 3616
Joined: Wed Sep 30, 2015 3:48 am

Re: Interpreter's "Witnesses" Film Threatens to Overtake the FAIR Mormon Conference

Post by _Dr Exiled »

I think showing the plates on the table, not using them, but instead resorting to the tried and true method of translation, that of a rock in a hat, is a mistake and the brethren should be warned. First of all it shows how silly the "translation" story is. Looking on a rock in a hat that supposedly has words on it (Early Modern English words to boot) is beyond belief and will lead more out once they realize that this is the real history. DCP shouldn't highlight this, but should put it back in the closet where it lay for decades.

It also brings up another question of why all the pomp and circumstance with the three and eight witnesses? The plates are on the table. Why not just lift the napkin off and see them? Again, why not actually use the plates in the damned translation? Yet, there needs to be some special ceremony of seeing the stupid plates. It's obvious that the ceremony was needed to satisfy the critics that knew the plates never existed objectively. It couldn't be a Palmyra wide demonstration because obviously the hoax would have been exposed. So, Joseph took three super credulous dupes or possible confederates (Cowdery) to be his witnesses and eight dupes, three of which were family confederates to supposedly "see" the plates. How anyone could believe the real history is beyond belief.

I can see it now in MTC role playing:

Investigator: You mean to tell me that God had golden plates hidden up in America and remotely translated into Early Modern English at some point and then given to Joseph Smith so he could ignore them and instead use his trusty rock in hat method of translation?

Missionary: Yes.

Investigator: Why of course! That's how God certainly would do it. Everyone knows that using a rock in a hat is the tried and true method for translating ancient scripture. The Early Modern English translation fits perfectly into God's plan because that is the language of the 1611 King James Bible. And who doesn't like Shakespeare? Sure, I will join and so will my five male children and extended family of mostly male children. I am excited that they will one day hold the priesthood of God!

Missionary: Great!
"Religion is about providing human community in the guise of solving problems that don’t exist or failing to solve problems that do and seeking to reconcile these contradictions and conceal the failures in bogus explanations otherwise known as theology." - Kishkumen 
_Tom
_Emeritus
Posts: 1023
Joined: Mon Jun 11, 2007 5:45 pm

Re: Interpreter's "Witnesses" Film Threatens to Overtake the FAIR Mormon Conference

Post by _Tom »

I checked FairMormon’s Facebook page for a clip of Dr. Peterson’s conference address, which apparently featured several clips from the Witnesses film. For some reason, though, clips from every conference address on Friday but his have been posted. I must say that Dr. Peterson's presentation's opening image of Joseph Smith holding a hat several inches from his face while dictating (see here) is inconsistent with witness testimony (he reportedly pressed his face into the hat to block out light). Are the producers of the million-dollar Witnesses project seeking to be historically accurate or not?

It appears that the conference featured at least one special musical number: an apparent take on Elder Marlin Jensen’s 2011 comments on the extent of modern-day apostasy ("Maybe since Kirtland, we’ve never had a period of – I’ll call it apostasy, like we’re having now"). Some lyrics: “Thousands may walk away, but I will, I will never leave … thousands may stand against, but I will, I will fight for you!” I am not making this up (see here). I hope next year’s conference will feature a performance of “The Ballad of Lou the Mean,” with Dr. Peterson on the hurdy-gurdy and Mr. Schryver playing the piano and handling gruff vocals.
“A scholar said he could not read the Book of Mormon, so we shouldn’t be shocked that scholars say the papyri don’t translate and/or relate to the Book of Abraham. Doesn’t change anything. It’s ancient and historical.” ~ Hanna Seariac
_Doctor Scratch
_Emeritus
Posts: 8025
Joined: Sat Apr 18, 2009 4:44 pm

Re: Interpreter's "Witnesses" Film Threatens to Overtake the FAIR Mormon Conference

Post by _Doctor Scratch »

Wow, Tom. I don't believe they've featured entertainment like that in the past. Back in the good ol' days, this was more like the usual staid academic conference. How often are there musical numbers like this at typical scholarly conferences? Well, I guess they've decided to ditch the facade altogether, and frame this in a way that's more in keeping with Evangelical mega-churches. Scott Gordon, I'm sure, knows who butters his bread.
"[I]f, while hoping that everybody else will be honest and so forth, I can personally prosper through unethical and immoral acts without being detected and without risk, why should I not?." --Daniel Peterson, 6/4/14
Post Reply