Tom Philips conspiracy theories - Add your own pet theory!

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Ceeboo
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Re: Tom Philips conspiracy theories - Add your own pet theor

Post by Ceeboo »

Tobin wrote:
Yes, in the incredible year of 2013 we learned that Swedish members of the LDS Church didn't seem to know very much about it and that the Book of Mormon seems to be a 19th century work. I can't wait for Tom to reveal that many LDS members in Utah tend to be Republicans.


:lol: :lol:


Not bad, Tobin!
Color me impressed! :smile:

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Ceeboo

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honorentheos
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Re: Tom Philips conspiracy theories - Add your own pet theor

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Tobin wrote:
honorentheos wrote:Thinking about it, 2013 has already been an incredible year regardless of any contribution Tom Philips might make. Between the New York Times report on Hans Mattsson and doubt in the church in late July and the ongoing discussion stemming from Chris Johnson's presentation alone one senses the momentum is shifting faster than the church is prepared to respond.

As I believe Chris Johnson said in his presentation, it's been the pursuit of truth that ultimately led me out of the church and where I continue to find interest when it relates to Mormonism. If Tom Philips can contribute even more to this momentum, then I wish him well in his pursuits.


Yes, in the incredible year of 2013 we learned that Swedish members of the LDS Church didn't seem to know very much about it and that the Book of Mormon seems to be a 19th century work. I can't wait for Tom to reveal that many LDS members in Utah tend to be Republicans.

Maybe better said as,

"We learned the LDS church couldn't answer common questions about the church and it's history that members easily discover on the internet, and confirmed the Book of Mormon owes significantly more to the 19th century frontier New York than any other culture or time period."

or, alternatively

"We confirmed the church has, in fact, been teaching a sanitized version of history for which there is no faithful "grown up" alternative when it's true history is known, one of which issues is that Joseph Smith likely made up the claim the Book of Mormon was ancient Christian scripture from the pre-European New World."

or

"If you pursue truth regardless of where it takes you, you'll probably end up out of the church by way of Sweden and 19th century upstate New York. That, or praying to aliens."
The world is always full of the sound of waves..but who knows the heart of the sea, a hundred feet down? Who knows it's depth?
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Tobin
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Re: Tom Philips conspiracy theories - Add your own pet theor

Post by Tobin »

honorentheos wrote:
Tobin wrote:Yes, in the incredible year of 2013 we learned that Swedish members of the LDS Church didn't seem to know very much about it and that the Book of Mormon seems to be a 19th century work. I can't wait for Tom to reveal that many LDS members in Utah tend to be Republicans.

Maybe better said as,

"We learned the LDS church couldn't answer common questions about the church and it's history that members easily discover on the internet, and confirmed the Book of Mormon owes significantly more to the 19th century frontier New York than any other culture or time period."

or, alternatively

"We confirmed the church has, in fact, been teaching a sanitized version of history for which there is no faithful "grown up" alternative when it's true history is known, one of which issues is that Joseph Smith likely made up the claim the Book of Mormon was ancient Christian scripture from the pre-European New World."

or

"If you pursue truth regardless of where it takes you, you'll probably end up out of the church by way of Sweden and 19th century upstate New York. That, or praying to aliens."


Thanks, but I like my version.
"You lack vision, but I see a place where people get on and off the freeway. On and off, off and on all day, all night.... Tire salons, automobile dealerships and wonderful, wonderful billboards reaching as far as the eye can see. My God, it'll be beautiful." -- Judge Doom

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Mercury
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Re: Tom Philips conspiracy theories - Add your own pet theor

Post by Mercury »

Here we see a rare picture of Elders approaching the secret lair of Mormonism's true Master, an Eldritch horror of unspeakable, insanity inducing madness.

http://i.imgur.com/2aKaqXm.jpg
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Saw Skooh
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Re: Tom Philips conspiracy theories - Add your own pet theor

Post by Saw Skooh »

At this point I call BS. Tom, its getting rather silly at this point.


I've been seeing a lot of similar comments to this on various online forums. "At this point"? Meaning, a mere handful of days after the initial conference where he originally planned on presenting but cancelled because he wasn't able? When he has clearly stated that he's working on something with an unexpected setbacks? How quickly we are entitled.

Vocal, public incredulity and denunciation because something is taking a little bit longer than one expects it ought to, or costs more than one thinks it should, when in fact one has no idea what it is or what obstacles are involved, comes off as not so much "skeptical" as unreasonable (at best), and at least a little bit rude (at worst). If Tom comes through, I hope to see some sincere humility and apologies by a number of characters on a number of forums.

Hang tough, Tom. A lot of people are willing to assume the best about your sincerity, take a chill pill, and wait it out. And thanks for engaging.

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Kishkumen
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Re: Tom Philips conspiracy theories - Add your own pet theor

Post by Kishkumen »

Well, Skooh, Tom probably ought not to have made such dramatic announcements at first. Now, every time he fails to produce, people will tease him about it. 'Tis human nature.
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Re: Tom Philips conspiracy theories - Add your own pet theor

Post by Mercury »

Saw Skooh wrote:
At this point I call BS. Tom, its getting rather silly at this point.


I've been seeing a lot of similar comments to this on various online forums. "At this point"? Meaning, a mere handful of days after the initial conference where he originally planned on presenting but cancelled because he wasn't able? When he has clearly stated that he's working on something with an unexpected setbacks? How quickly we are entitled.

Vocal, public incredulity and denunciation because something is taking a little bit longer than one expects it ought to, or costs more than one thinks it should, when in fact one has no idea what it is or what obstacles are involved, comes off as not so much "skeptical" as unreasonable (at best), and at least a little bit rude (at worst). If Tom comes through, I hope to see some sincere humility and apologies by a number of characters on a number of forums.

Hang tough, Tom. A lot of people are willing to assume the best about your sincerity, take a chill pill, and wait it out. And thanks for engaging.


And another Tomite appears. You are right. I'm just rude. How dare I suss out and parse Toms actions and statements regarding what is in his own words earth shaking. How dare I hold someone to the same standards we hold MormonCorp (tm) to. How dare someone ask why it was required for him to be present in Salt Lake in order to release his monumental information.

But don't worry. As long as you have faith Tom will one day deliver, as long as there are whispers within his circle of confidence that he is the one true exmo prophet.
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Yahoo Bot
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Re: Tom Philips conspiracy theories - Add your own pet theor

Post by Yahoo Bot »

My view of Phillips is that he may have some interesting things to say but he is woefully semi-literate and given to hyperbole, so I'm not sure how believable he will be to those inclined to distrust him.

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Bazooka
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Re: Tom Philips conspiracy theories - Add your own pet theor

Post by Bazooka »

Tobin wrote:Yes, in the incredible year of 2013 we learned that Swedish members of the LDS Church didn't seem to know very much about it and that the Book of Mormon seems to be a 19th century work. I can't wait for Tom to reveal that many LDS members in Utah tend to be Republicans.


Says the man who was stopped from having sex by God's personal intervention...
That said, with the Book of Mormon, we are not dealing with a civilization with no written record. What we are dealing with is a written record with no civilization. (Runtu, Feb 2015)

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Re: Tom Philips conspiracy theories - Add your own pet theor

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Tom Phillips wrote:Bottom line - I am engaged with something that I think will have a major impact on the church. That is my personal opinion and others may think differently, that it is nothing. It has complexities and timing issues and fairly considerable financial cost. The nay sayers will understand these when it is released. So, if you are genuinely interested, please be patient a little longer. I hope not to disappoint but, hey, I am human. I do not claim to be a prophet of God or anything special. I just want the truth out there for future generations, if not this generation. Many of us have TBM families who will probably go to their graves believing. My hope is for those who are open to the truth and for future generations. Let's not continue this delusional myth.



These seems to suggest that the big reveal won't be any time soon. In fact it suggests that this generation may not even see it.

Is your timescale (which I appreciate may not be fully within your control) in the realm of weeks, months, years, decades or longer?
That said, with the Book of Mormon, we are not dealing with a civilization with no written record. What we are dealing with is a written record with no civilization. (Runtu, Feb 2015)

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Re: Tom Philips conspiracy theories - Add your own pet theor

Post by Tom Phillips »

Weeks. The generation comment referred to those dyed in the wool that will not let anything impair their 'testimony'.

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Re: Tom Philips conspiracy theories - Add your own pet theor

Post by 15shameless »

I think Tom needs to be careful and stop playing games with peoples emotions. We had more than enough of that psycho ____ when we were under the constant monitoring of Mormon control. He has made various assertions that the church is about to be hit with something major, but yet again we will just need to wait a little longer. It is both fascinating and irritating. It reminds me of hanging about outside the Bishops office along with the other slaves as we were forced to wait patiently for an audience. It is possible that being constantly subjected to the unique weirdness of the great Mormon experiment is something that is just too difficult for most of us to permanently escape from. Tom as we crave for justice even retribution to come out of this all enveloping Mormon insanity, please keep in mind that the long suffering natives, although waiting with great expectation, are growing increasingly restless.

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Mercury
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Re: Tom Philips conspiracy theories - Add your own pet theor

Post by Mercury »

Tom Phillips wrote:Weeks. The generation comment referred to those dyed in the wool that will not let anything impair their 'testimony'.


Thank you for your input Tom. I'm still skeptical but that does not mean I do not respect you.
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Kyle Reese
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Re: Tom Philips conspiracy theories - Add your own pet theor

Post by Kyle Reese »

Tom Phillips wrote:Weeks. The generation comment referred to those dyed in the wool that will not let anything impair their 'testimony'.

Hang in there, Tom. I appreciate you jumping onto the board to clarify some of the misconceptions about your project.
It's true that we don't always tell them the full story. - DCP

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Re: Tom Philips conspiracy theories - Add your own pet theor

Post by suniluni2 »

Bazooka wrote:Is your timescale (which I appreciate may not be fully within your control) in the realm of weeks, months, years, decades or longer?

Tom Phillips wrote:Weeks. The generation comment referred to those dyed in the wool that will not let anything impair their 'testimony'.

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Res Ipsa
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Re: Tom Philips conspiracy theories - Add your own pet theor

Post by Res Ipsa »

Damn, there goes my theory that Tom is a member of the Bavarian Illuminati.
​“The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists.”

― Hannah Arendt, The Origins of Totalitarianism, 1951

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Kishkumen
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Re: Tom Philips conspiracy theories - Add your own pet theor

Post by Kishkumen »

It sounds like some kind of online project for disseminating information like Mormon Think, etc.

Or perhaps a documentary film?
"Petition wasn’t meant to start a witch hunt as I’ve said 6000 times." ~ Hanna Seariac, LDS apologist

Ceeboo
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Re: Tom Philips conspiracy theories - Add your own pet theor

Post by Ceeboo »

Kish-Q-men! :smile:

Kishkumen wrote:It sounds like some kind of online project for disseminating information like Mormon Think, etc.

Or perhaps a documentary film?


My guess is that a MTV rap video is in the works.

But.....I could be wrong!

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Saw Skooh
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Re: Tom Philips conspiracy theories - Add your own pet theor

Post by Saw Skooh »

How dare someone ask why it was required for him to be present in Salt Lake ....

I was referring to all of the "bs" and "silly at this point" type of rhetoric. Questions are fair, so long as its understood that nobody owes anybody immediate answers.
How dare I suss out and parse Toms actions and statements regarding what is in his own words earth shaking.

We've all seen the same handful of hints and promises. The bottom line is that despite all of the "parsing" and "sussing", we don't know what's causing the delay or why.
...another Tomite appears.
...whispers within his circle of confidence that he is the one true exmo prophet

I don't know this guy at all. He has no idea who I am. I have access only to the same public info (i.e. very little) as you. I can see that he's been gracious enough to offer brief updates right here, quite recently. I parse and suss as much as anyone, and I advocate rational skepticism and accountability. But all in due time, for Pete's sake. GIve the guy a chance, if you respect him.

My main point is just this: It really hasn't been that long. Conclusive judgments are premature. How about we relax and watch it play out first?

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Bazooka
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Re: Tom Philips conspiracy theories - Add your own pet theor

Post by Bazooka »

Tom Phillips wrote:Weeks. The generation comment referred to those dyed in the wool that will not let anything impair their 'testimony'.


I appreciate your reply.
I will withhold throwing more chips in until you lay down your cards and show us your Full House. :biggrin:
That said, with the Book of Mormon, we are not dealing with a civilization with no written record. What we are dealing with is a written record with no civilization. (Runtu, Feb 2015)

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Abaddon
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Re: Tom Philips conspiracy theories - Add your own pet theor

Post by Abaddon »

Kishkumen wrote:I would be interested to know what price one puts on having a strong, supportive community when one believes in something, and why those who no longer believe want to damage it for those who do. OK, I am interested in questions the answers to which can be damaging to faith. But I have no interest in proselytizing unbelief. Here I see someone who is out to harm the LDS Church, and I have to ask, why?


I'm not out to proselyte disbelief. I am for both sides of the story to be known.

Anecdotal story. My mother (who knows I am an ex-mormon) invited me and my family to attend the open house at the Gilbert temple in Jan 2014. I told her I would be happy to attend the open house if she would sit down with me and I can go over, in depth, why the Temple (to me) is a symbol of deceit and corruption.

If my mother, after hearing my side of the story on the Temple, still continues to believe, then let the grace of God go with her. But I want her to at least know what I do and then make a willing choice.

At worst, she'll think I'm firmly in the grips of the sophistry of Satan. At best, she'll have empathy for why I believe (or disbelieve) what I do rather than paying lip service to it.

Same with my nephew going on a mission. I'm close to my nephew and I'm sure he'll invite me to his mission farewell. I will tell him I will go to his farewell after he's read through MormonThink.com and gets the other side of the story. If he chooses to preach the Mormon cause on his mission after knowing both sides of the story, then I would wish him well.

My goal isn't to deconvert; I just want them to know what I do and then make an informed choice.

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