Blood Atonement: Is it real?

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_Rollo Tomasi
_Emeritus
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Post by _Rollo Tomasi »

Plutarch wrote:I like Dr. Quinn's works and routinely rely upon them. However, I do so cautiously as his Power and Magical works did not endure much peer review, at least as the WSJ says. And I have chased down some of his cites involving my own ancestors and found him to be overreaching.

The Wall Street Journal article did not say this. It mentions Robert Newman, dean of humanities at the U. of Utah, saying that the reason the U. did not hire Quinn for a full professor spot was "because [Quinn's] research presentation wasn't strong enough and most of his books weren't published by university presses" (this is my quote of the article; the article does not actually quote Newman). But the article also notes that BYU history prof. Thomas Alexander and U. history prof. James Clayton praised Quinn's scholarship, but agreed with the decision not to hire him because of his excommunicated status, which might not go over well in predominantly-LDS Utah. The article says nothing of "peer review" (I suspect you are assuming that is what Newman meant; even if he did, Newman's statement doesn't jive with the feelings expressed by Alexander and Clayton concerning Quinn's scholarship). Here's the irony noted in the WSJ article: after rejecting Quinn ostensibly for a poor research presentation and lack of university-press books, the U. then downgraded the opening to an assistant professorship and filled it with an active LDS member. Clearly, the state-runned U. of U. knows on which side its state-funded bread is buttered.
"Moving beyond apologist persuasion, LDS polemicists furiously (and often fraudulently) attack any non-traditional view of Mormonism. They don't mince words -- they mince the truth."

-- Mike Quinn, writing of the FARMSboys, in "Early Mormonism and the Magic World View," p. x (Rev. ed. 1998)
_Runtu
_Emeritus
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Joined: Sun Nov 05, 2006 5:06 am

Post by _Runtu »

Rollo Tomasi wrote:
Plutarch wrote:I like Dr. Quinn's works and routinely rely upon them. However, I do so cautiously as his Power and Magical works did not endure much peer review, at least as the WSJ says. And I have chased down some of his cites involving my own ancestors and found him to be overreaching.

The Wall Street Journal article did not say this. It mentions Robert Newman, dean of humanities at the U. of Utah, saying that the reason the U. did not hire Quinn for a full professor spot was "because [Quinn's] research presentation wasn't strong enough and most of his books weren't published by university presses" (this is my quote of the article; the article does not actually quote Newman). But the article also notes that BYU history prof. Thomas Alexander and U. history prof. James Clayton praised Quinn's scholarship, but agreed with the decision not to hire him because of his excommunicated status, which might not go over well in predominantly-LDS Utah. The article says nothing of "peer review" (I suspect you are assuming that is what Newman meant; even if he did, Newman's statement doesn't jive with the feelings expressed by Alexander and Clayton concerning Quinn's scholarship). Here's the irony noted in the WSJ article: after rejecting Quinn ostensibly for a poor research presentation and lack of university-press books, the U. then downgraded the opening to an assistant professorship and filled it with an active LDS member. Clearly, the state-runned U. of U. knows on which side its state-funded bread is buttered.


I haven't seen that WSJ article. Do you know where I could find it?
_rcrocket

Post by _rcrocket »

Rollo Tomasi wrote:
Plutarch wrote:I like Dr. Quinn's works and routinely rely upon them. However, I do so cautiously as his Power and Magical works did not endure much peer review, at least as the WSJ says. And I have chased down some of his cites involving my own ancestors and found him to be overreaching.

The Wall Street Journal article did not say this. It mentions Robert Newman, dean of humanities at the U. of Utah, saying that the reason the U. did not hire Quinn for a full professor spot was "because [Quinn's] research presentation wasn't strong enough and most of his books weren't published by university presses" (this is my quote of the article; the article does not actually quote Newman). But the article also notes that BYU history prof. Thomas Alexander and U. history prof. James Clayton praised Quinn's scholarship, but agreed with the decision not to hire him because of his excommunicated status, which might not go over well in predominantly-LDS Utah. The article says nothing of "peer review" (I suspect you are assuming that is what Newman meant; even if he did, Newman's statement doesn't jive with the feelings expressed by Alexander and Clayton concerning Quinn's scholarship). Here's the irony noted in the WSJ article: after rejecting Quinn ostensibly for a poor research presentation and lack of university-press books, the U. then downgraded the opening to an assistant professorship and filled it with an active LDS member. Clearly, the state-runned U. of U. knows on which side its state-funded bread is buttered.


Well, I read the article to imply lack of peer review. I don't think Signature Books edited his books very well; I've edited dozens of publications and it appears to me that no serious editor (i.e. peer reviewer) spent much time with his works.

Somebody needs to ask the Signature Books folks what kind of peer reviewer it applied to Quinn's two books. I do know that Quinn's book on Clark (which I absolutely loved and persuaded me to go to law school) when through extensive edits and review.
The style between that and the Signature Books books is striking.

P
_Rollo Tomasi
_Emeritus
Posts: 4085
Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 12:27 pm

Post by _Rollo Tomasi »

Runtu wrote:I haven't seen that WSJ article. Do you know where I could find it?

Here's a link:

http://www.supportmikequinn.net/wsj/
"Moving beyond apologist persuasion, LDS polemicists furiously (and often fraudulently) attack any non-traditional view of Mormonism. They don't mince words -- they mince the truth."

-- Mike Quinn, writing of the FARMSboys, in "Early Mormonism and the Magic World View," p. x (Rev. ed. 1998)
_Runtu
_Emeritus
Posts: 16721
Joined: Sun Nov 05, 2006 5:06 am

Post by _Runtu »

Rollo Tomasi wrote:
Runtu wrote:I haven't seen that WSJ article. Do you know where I could find it?

Here's a link:

http://www.supportmikequinn.net/wsj/


Thanks, Rollo.
_Rollo Tomasi
_Emeritus
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Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 12:27 pm

Post by _Rollo Tomasi »

Plutarch wrote:Well, I read the article to imply lack of peer review.

Fair enough.

I don't think Signature Books edited his books very well;

I have found some sloppy mistakes as well from time to time, but, overall, I think Quinn's books published by Signature are magnificent (in terms of substance, not the mistakes and typos).

Somebody needs to ask the Signature Books folks what kind of peer reviewer it applied to Quinn's two books.

Quinn has published at least 4 books with Signature, but I do not know what peer review was applied.

I do know that Quinn's book on Clark (which I absolutely loved and persuaded me to go to law school) when through extensive edits and review.

Indeed, a great book. by the way, the latest (and very extensive) version of Quinn's bio of Clark, Elder Statesman, was published in 2002 by Signature. I do not know who published earlier versions.
"Moving beyond apologist persuasion, LDS polemicists furiously (and often fraudulently) attack any non-traditional view of Mormonism. They don't mince words -- they mince the truth."

-- Mike Quinn, writing of the FARMSboys, in "Early Mormonism and the Magic World View," p. x (Rev. ed. 1998)
_Roger Morrison
_Emeritus
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Joined: Sat Nov 11, 2006 4:13 am

Post by _Roger Morrison »

This might have been said before, but:

IF a church is to "restore all things" where is the line drawn? BA is a part of our Judeo-Christian herritage.

Which was carried into Utah Legislation by LDS influence that Capital Punishment was initially by firing squad, then by choice, to facilitate "spilling blood". Not sure, if the practice still exists??? Utah folks...???

Preposterous as it is, it was a part of early Mormonism. AND Old Testament practice. So be it. It isn't now, good! RM
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