Why isn't Trump instituting Russian sanctions?

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_MeDotOrg
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Why isn't Trump instituting Russian sanctions?

Post by _MeDotOrg »

However you may feel about Donald Trump or Hillary Clinton, the Russian interference in the 2016 Presidential election should concern you. Whether or not Donald Trump was complicit or obstructed justice is not the point or Mueller's most recent indictment.

The point of Mueller's indictment is that there was a concerted effort by Russia to undermine our Presidential election. Short of a Military attack on our borders, an attack on our Democratic system is an act of war against the United States. Our President complains about the State Department, the Justice Department, the Special Prosecutor, the Attorney General and the Assistant Attorney General.

But he is amazingly mute when it comes to calling out the Russians. And he refuses to enact the sanctions that have been approved by Congress. Can someone provide me with a logical reason why he is so reticent? Does he still believe Vladimir Putin told him the truth? What is holding him back? The one thing he could do to help disprove the case that he somehow beholding to the Russians-----and he still refuses to do it?

Something is not right here.
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_Maxine Waters
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Re: Why isn't Trump instituting Russian sanctions?

Post by _Maxine Waters »

Why didn't the Obama administration do anything about Russian interference in the election?
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_EAllusion
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Re: Why isn't Trump instituting Russian sanctions?

Post by _EAllusion »

Maxine Waters wrote:Why didn't the Obama administration do anything about Russian interference in the election?
The Obama administration took counter-measures both during and after the election. Before the election, the Obama admin issued warnings to Russia and focused energy on protecting voting systems. After the election, it took a sanctions response and supposedly covert actions we are not privy to. The one big thing it didn't do that it could've was release the internal conclusions of intelligence to the American people before the election so they could understand the Russian influence campaign against them and react in their voting behavior accordingly. He tried to, but the reason he ultimately didn't do that is Mitch McConnell promised to make it a partisan issue which would undermine the credibility of the release. (He probably should've released anyway, but too late for that.) In fact, a pre-election sanctions response would've required informing the American people.

The Flynn issue that you badly misunderstood is related to this. During the transition period, Flynn discussed sanctions with the Russian ambassador. He lied about it to the FBI and American public. But he's an incompetent boob and apparently didn't appreciate that intelligence would bug the Russian ambassador. This is the former director of the DNI mind you. The Trump camp, led by Pence in public, continued to lie about what occurred during the meeting even though they were internally informed otherwise by the DoJ. This continued until the Washington Post used leaks to report what actually occurred. That led to Flynn's ouster. It was justified at the time that this happened because Pence was lied to by Flynn which led to Pence innocently repeating that lie to the public, but we know now that they were informed already of Flynn's lies before that.

So, shortly after that conversation about sanctions and lie about it occurred, Russia publicly declined to respond with counter-measures to the US response. Trump publicly praised V. Putin as being "smart" for doing this. Then once in office, Trump has done everything possible to weaken, undermine, and not enforce US sanctions towards Russia.

Why?
_Kevin Graham
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Re: Why isn't Trump instituting Russian sanctions?

Post by _Kevin Graham »

Maxine Waters wrote:Why didn't the Obama administration do anything about Russian interference in the election?


In other news, Majax wonders how come Obama didn't try to do anything about skyrocketing healthcare costs and rate of uninsured.
_EAllusion
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Re: Why isn't Trump instituting Russian sanctions?

Post by _EAllusion »

Even now, US intelligence has concluded that Russia is actively seeking to interfere in US elections including the 2018 midterms. They have testified to Congress of this fact. They have also testified that President Trump has held no meeting to address this. And we know that Donald Trump is refusing to enforce sanctions response passed by overwhelming Congressional majorities. Republicans have looked the other way on Trump's refusal, but it is an arguable constitutional crisis. Why is Trump doing this?

Here are some not mutually exclusive possibilities:

1) Like all of us, Donald Trump is aware that Russians plan to intervene on his behalf by bolstering his and Republican election chances. He welcomes this. Therefore, he kills efforts to deter it.

2) Donald Trump has had a clandestine cooperative partnership with Russia and not enforcing sanctions was his end of the bargain.

3) Donald Trump is aware that Russia has dirt on him and adopts a very friendly posture towards the nation's interests in order to appease them.

These are all plausible. What plausible possibilities remain that don't have traitorous implications?

The only one that is frequently thrown out there is that Trump is such a narcissist that he can't abide anything that undermines the legitimacy of his victory. Therefore, he will not abide any action that suggests Russia intervened on his behalf because doing so strongly implies his election victory was not legitimate. Therefore, he will not dignify a retaliatory response as that implies retaliation is warranted.

If that were true, that's unfathomably awful in its own way, but given the totality of evidence before us, there's no way that's the most plausible explanation at this point.
_Maksutov
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Re: Why isn't Trump instituting Russian sanctions?

Post by _Maksutov »

Maxine Waters wrote:Why didn't the Obama administration do anything about Russian interference in the election?


Hey, shall we go back over 200 years of US history and talk about every freaking thing that ever happened, rather than address the question? Talk about Obama, blame Obama. I remember the Rs shrieking at Obama criticizing Bush, even though that dork presided over the greatest intelligence failure and terrorist act in US history and invaded the wrong gd country after putting up Colin to lie to the UN. So that vast compounded cluster met with your approval but you're clutching your pearls, a triggered snowflake, a whining wimpy pussy, at the very idea that someone could criticize your Draft Dodging Chicken Hawk in Chief. :lol:
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_MeDotOrg
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Re: Why isn't Trump instituting Russian sanctions?

Post by _MeDotOrg »

From the New York Times:

State Dept. Was Granted $120 Million to Fight Russian Meddling. It Has Spent $0.

As Russia’s virtual war against the United States continues unabated with the midterm elections approaching, the State Department has yet to spend any of the $120 million it has been allocated since late 2016 to counter foreign efforts to meddle in elections or sow distrust in democracy.

As a result, not one of the 23 analysts working in the department’s Global Engagement Center — which has been tasked with countering Moscow’s disinformation campaign — speaks Russian, and a department hiring freeze has hindered efforts to recruit the computer experts needed to track the Russian efforts.

The delay is just one symptom of the largely passive response to the Russian interference by President Trump, who has made little if any public effort to rally the nation to confront Moscow and defend democratic institutions. More broadly, the funding lag reflects a deep lack of confidence by Secretary of State Rex W. Tillerson in his department’s ability to execute its historically wide-ranging mission and spend its money wisely.

Mr. Tillerson has voiced skepticism that the United States is even capable of doing anything to counter the Russian threat.

“If it’s their intention to interfere, they’re going to find ways to do that,” Mr. Tillerson said in an interview last month with Fox News. “And we can take steps we can take, but this is something that once they decide they are going to do it, it’s very difficult to pre-empt it.”

I cannot believe the American Secretary of State has such a defeatist attitude about the problem.

I say again: Something is not right here. This is not the way patriotic Americans talk when there is a threat to our democratic system.

Vladimir Putin announces new nuclear missiles and Trump tweets about Alec (or should I say Alex?) Baldwin.

Nero fiddles while Rome burns.
"The great problem of any civilization is how to rejuvenate itself without rebarbarization."
- Will Durant
"We've kept more promises than we've even made"
- Donald Trump
"Of what meaning is the world without mind? The question cannot exist."
- Edwin Land
_moksha
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Re: Why isn't Trump instituting Russian sanctions?

Post by _moksha »

Maxine Waters wrote:Why didn't the Obama administration do anything about Russian interference in the election?

Why didn't Smokey the Bear put out that fateful cigarette butt before it burned down the forest you ask?

It is hard to prevent original first-time acts before they happen. For instance, fire safety and prevention was never instituted before the first fire.

Now if Smokey had been in the pocket of the Evil Arsonist's Association, perhaps his reluctance to do what is necessary to prevent forest fires would be tempered by his greedy self-interest rather than concern for his fellow woodland creatures.

Hope that helps.
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_subgenius
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Re: Why isn't Trump instituting Russian sanctions?

Post by _subgenius »

EAllusion wrote:
Maxine Waters wrote:Why didn't the Obama administration do anything about Russian interference in the election?
The Obama administration took counter-measures both during and after the election. Before the election, the Obama admin issued warnings to Russia and focused energy on protecting voting systems. ...snip...

yet when they informed the few states that had their voting systems invaded they withheld the knowledge that it was Russians...how can that omission be termed a focused effort?

It seems that Obama's focus was a little blurry on Russia because the dossier that he used to obtain a FISA warrant was of a Russian flavor and if the public had found out that Obama obtained a shoddy warrant to spy on an American citizen solely in support of Hillary Clinton then her corruption quickly becomes Obam,a's corruption...and he nor his wife are sacrificing book deals for that.
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_moksha
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Re: Why isn't Trump instituting Russian sanctions?

Post by _moksha »

subgenius wrote:It seems that Obama's focus was a little blurry on Russia because the dossier that he used to obtain a FISA warrant was of a Russian flavor and if the public had found out that Obama obtained a shoddy warrant to spy on an American citizen solely in support of Hillary Clinton then her corruption quickly becomes Obam,a's corruption...and he nor his wife are sacrificing book deals for that.

Those being surveilled were clearly acting as foreign agents and those who were giving them money were trying to buy influence with a future corrupt politician. Trying to blame Obama for that seems like one of those "say anything" arguments.
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