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 Post subject: disorder of assumption
PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2014 5:44 am 
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"Dr. Paul R. McHugh, the former psychiatrist-in-chief for Johns Hopkins Hospital and its current Distinguished Service Professor of Psychiatry, said that transgenderism is a “mental disorder” that merits treatment, that sex change is “biologically impossible,” and that people who promote sexual reassignment surgery are collaborating with and promoting a mental disorder."
...
“’Sex change’ is biologically impossible,” said McHugh. “People who undergo sex-reassignment surgery do not change from men to women or vice versa. Rather, they become feminized men or masculinized women. Claiming that this is civil-rights matter and encouraging surgical intervention is in reality to collaborate with and promote a mental disorder.”

http://cnsnews.com/news/article/michael ... sex-change

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 Post subject: Re: disorder of assumption
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 2:17 pm 
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Just as I love others & myself despite human weaknesses, I also love family & friends who've developed homosexual preferences. I consider pretending something that is disordered is healthy as unloving... Caring more about "appearing loving" than actually loving. This & so many ad hominem attacks (homophobe, bigot, etc) is why I don't trust the integrity of anybody who dishonors the reality by which we all came to exist. The whole homosexual trend is so full of double standards & hypocrisy. It's especially sad to have this pushed on kids at such a young age.
Equality's Next Victims: Transgendering Our Children
http://www.tfpstudentaction.org/politic ... ldren.html

From another (philosophy) forum:

"Society accepts and for the most part embraces transgender individuals...people who generally believe they are the opposite sex and will go to great lengths to dress up/ receive medical procedures to appear as the desired opposite sex. It is looked down upon to call these people abnormal, crazy, confused, etc.

Suppose there was an individual who believed down to the bare bones that he was Captain Jack Sparrow from Pirates of the Caribbean. He dresses up like Jack Sparrow, talks like Jack Sparrow, eats like Jack Sparrow, and even demands he be allowed to dress up like Jack Sparrow at his job because he IS Jack Sparrow. Now imagine you go to a McDonalds to order food, or see an insurance agent or real estate agent and they are dressed up like Jack Sparrow, acting like Jack Sparrow , behaving like Jack Sparrow...the works. Though he may be competent at his job and do his job well, Most people would be put off, or think the individual is not right in the head. However, if a transgender individual were to do the same, people instantly become welcoming, and abandon judgement because they know if they were to judge or call the transgender crazy, they would be called bigoted, ignorant..all of the above.

So if we are to accept transgenders for who they are and withhold our criticism and judgement, should we not judge or deem crazy the people who truly in their hearts believe they are Jack Sparrow, JFK, George Washington.. etc. "


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 Post subject: Re: disorder of assumption
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 2:55 pm 
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Amore wrote:
Just as I love others & myself despite human weaknesses, I also love family & friends who've developed homosexual preferences.


This is the defining sentence of your post. It says everything about your confused thoughts on human sexuality. Here is a good place to start on educating yourself.

http://www.kinseyinstitute.org/research/ak-hhscale.html

There has been much more research done since then. Good reading.

At what age did you develop your heterosexual preferences?

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 Post subject: Re: disorder of assumption
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 3:15 pm 
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Quasi, I actually considered this the defining sentence:

Quote:
I consider pretending something that is disordered is healthy as unloving.


To which I respond: I consider pretending something that is healthy as disordered as hating. I consider pretending to be loving while in reality hating as hypocritical. I can understand why the poster is sensitive to the terms bigot and homophobe.

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 Post subject: Re: disorder of assumption
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 3:16 pm 
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I gradually developed sexuality, and luckily because I had a relatively positive relationships & experiences, I didn't get confused sexually or with gender identity. I wasn't "born" with a desire to have sex with anybody. :lol: Yet, those pushing homosexuality on everyone try to insist such is the case, even when human development obviously proves that environment plays a larger role in much, especially psychology and intrapersonal relating, than genes do. There is not gay gene - and even if there were any hormonal abnormality, environmental cues must be present for a trait or preference to be expressed. It's so obvious it seems ridiculous to point this out - but it's because of homosexual brain washing. We are born with brains that are only 25% developed, so we can adapt to environmental influences. Yes, sometimes homosexual preferences are developed early, especially in the case of sexual abuse, or other dysfunctional relationships, but studies show over & over that homosexuality is learned, not inborn.

It's pretty much a sexual substitute. So, why is anal sex & dildos so much better than other sexual substitutes? They're not - it's just because a group of homosexuals have some money and influence and have brainwashed people into thinking that having developed certain sexual substitutes earns one special "rights." What nonsense - and people like you fall for it.


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 Post subject: Re: disorder of assumption
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 3:24 pm 
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Brad Hudson wrote:
To which I respond: I consider pretending something that is healthy as disordered as hating.

It seems you need to research this topic more before writing false information.
This common tendency to be brainwashed by herd mentalities partially explains why so many have amazingly denied the obvious truth of human anatomy and reproduction & go along with redefining the basic foundation of society (marriage) to include "rights" based on sexual substitutes. All just to avoid be called bigot, homophobe, etc! It would be hilarious if the implications weren't so sad...

Amore wrote:
Equality's Next Victims: Transgendering Our Children
http://www.tfpstudentaction.org/politic ... ldren.html


The US CDC has collected health reports with statistics that show homosexual practices have many (40X more) cases of STDS, many more cases of AIDS/HIVs and mental illness. Even in 2 healthy males, anal sex runs risks of anal fissures, anal cancer, colon rupture and bacterial infection.

"Children Need Both A Mother And A Father" Dr. A. Dean Byrd http://www.narth.com/docs/needboth.html

"Why Children need both Mother-Love and Father-Love" Glenn T. Stanton http://www.jashow.org/Articles/_PDFArch ... I0804G.pdf

"Mothers' and Fathers' Socializing Behaviors in Three Contexts: Links with Children's Peer Competence" Pettit, Gregory S.; Brown, Elizabeth Glyn; Mize, Jacquelyn; Lindsey, Eric http://www.eric.ed.gov/ERICWebPortal/se ... o=EJ563106

"Why Children Need a Mother and a Father" Bill Muehlenberg http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2010/10/ ... -a-father/

Child of lesbian couple speaks out against gay marriage http://www.dennyburk.com/child-of-lesbi ... -marriage/

I suppose you think it's loving and healthy to legally deny a child a mother or father. It doesn't matter that adult children have come out against same-sex marriage - feeling the loss of learning from both sex parents. It seems you just want to APPEAR loving to those most hateful if you're not keeping up appearances. You wouldn't want to be called bigot and homophobe, just for asserting axiomatic facts.

Quote:
I consider pretending to be loving while in reality hating as hypocritical. I can understand why the poster is sensitive to the terms bigot and homophobe.


1) "In individuals, insanity is rare; but in groups, parties, nations and epochs, it is the rule."


2) A book called After the Ball by Marshall Kirk, Published in 1990, is said to be brilliant piece of writing, which argued that gays must portray themselves in a positive way to straight America, and that the main aim of making homosexuality acceptable could be achieved by getting Americans "to think that it is just another thing, with a shrug of their shoulders". Then "your battle for legal and social rights is virtually won".

Two quotes from the Kirk book, aimed at showing how to use advertising and PR to advance the agenda:

"Thus propagandistic advertising can depict all opponents of the gay movement as homophobic bigots who are 'not Christian' and the propaganda can further show them as being criticized, hated and shunned"....
"Our effect is achieved without reference to facts, logic or proof.... the person's beliefs can be altered whether he is conscious of the attack or not".


Last edited by Amore on Fri Sep 05, 2014 3:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: disorder of assumption
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 3:28 pm 
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I'm sorry you carry around this hatred of your fellow persons, Amore. I really am.

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 Post subject: Re: disorder of assumption
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 3:31 pm 
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Brad Hudson wrote:
I'm sorry you carry around this hatred of your fellow persons, Amore. I really am.

You sound just like a TBM who is so sorry I "carry around this hatred" that the church is misspending sacred funds.
You can take the guy out of the cult, but you can't take the cult out of the guy... in most cases.

When is love based on LIES about proven statistics of sickness and even death???
Former gay rights leader and ex homosexual Michael Glatz said, "Homosexuality is death and I choose life."
Is it more loving to pretend everything's all rainbows and happy - when in reality, homosexual practices lead to many types of pain and sickness?


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 Post subject: Re: disorder of assumption
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 3:36 pm 
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Amore wrote:
Brad Hudson wrote:
I'm sorry you carry around this hatred of your fellow persons, Amore. I really am.

You sound just like a TBM who is so sorry I "carry around this hatred" that the church is misspending sacred funds.
You can take the guy out of the cult, but you can't take the cult out of the guy... in most cases.

When is love based on LIES about proven statistics of sickness and even death???
Former gay rights leader and ex homosexual Michael Glatz said, "Homosexuality is death and I choose life."
Is it more loving to pretend everything's all rainbows and happy - when in reality, homosexual practices lead to many types of pain and sickness?


The one thing I respect the Westboro Baptist Church folks for is honesty. At least they can admit to hating. Guys like you twist yourselves into pretzels trying to convince yourselves that your hatred is really love.

I don't pretend that everything is rainbows and happy. But I don't pretend that my hatred is loving. And I don't cherry pick a few quotes and stats to justify hatred.

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 Post subject: Re: disorder of assumption
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 3:38 pm 
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Look it up yourself, if you're really interested in the truth.
Search the United States Center for Disease Control and Homosexual - you'll find info on STDs, HIV/AIDS and Mental illness.
And regarding risks of anal sex - that can also be searched through medical websites.

Unless... love, for you is based on hiding from truth.


by the way...Are you aware of how you've played out the homosexual brainwashing?
"Thus propagandistic advertising can depict all opponents of the gay movement as homophobic bigots who are 'not Christian' and the propaganda can further show them as being criticized, hated and shunned"....

"Our effect is achieved without reference to facts, logic or proof.... the person's beliefs can be altered whether he is conscious of the attack or not".


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 Post subject: Re: disorder of assumption
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 3:49 pm 
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Amore wrote:
Look it up yourself, if you're really interested in the truth.
Search the United States Center for Disease Control and Homosexual - you'll find info on STDs, HIV/AIDS and Mental illness.
And regarding risks of anal sex - that can also be searched through medical websites.

Unless... love, for you is based on hiding from truth.


I understand the facts, probably better than you do. What I don't do is selectively sift through them to try and justify my hatred toward people who are different than me.

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 Post subject: Re: disorder of assumption
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 3:59 pm 
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If you understand the facts, what are the statistics of STDs, HIV/AIDs and mental illness among those who engage in homosexual practices?
How do men and women differ in terms of such statistics?
What are the risks of anal sex?

See, I don't think you really understand the "facts" otherwise you'd prove it, but what you've done is just talk in circles calling out names trying to shift the responsibility to another - engaging in ad hominem attack logical fallacy - which you've been trained to do, subconsciously.


Last edited by Amore on Fri Sep 05, 2014 4:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: disorder of assumption
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 4:00 pm 
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Brad Hudson wrote:
Quasi, I actually considered this the defining sentence:

Quote:
I consider pretending something that is disordered is healthy as unloving.


To which I respond: I consider pretending something that is healthy as disordered as hating. I consider pretending to be loving while in reality hating as hypocritical. I can understand why the poster is sensitive to the terms bigot and homophobe.


You may be right. Either statement gives an insight to Amore's agenda. The cat is out of the bag.

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 Post subject: Re: disorder of assumption
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 4:01 pm 
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Amore wrote:
Look it up yourself, if you're really interested in the truth.
Search the United States Center for Disease Control and Homosexual - you'll find info on STDs, HIV/AIDS and Mental illness.
And regarding risks of anal sex - that can also be searched through medical websites.

Unless... love, for you is based on hiding from truth.


by the way...Are you aware of how you've played out the homosexual brainwashing?
"Thus propagandistic advertising can depict all opponents of the gay movement as homophobic bigots who are 'not Christian' and the propaganda can further show them as being criticized, hated and shunned"....

"Our effect is achieved without reference to facts, logic or proof.... the person's beliefs can be altered whether he is conscious of the attack or not".


LOL. Victim of religious brainwashing claims that everyone else is brainwashed. See, you've bought into the anti-gay propaganda that you can be a good Christian and hate gays, too because, really, you love them more than people who want to let them get married and raise children. And your beliefs have been shaped without you even knowing it!

See how this works!! You only believe what you believe because of anti-gay propaganda. And you can't deny it because denying it is part of what you've been taught to do!!!!!!!!!

Isn't this fun?

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 Post subject: Re: disorder of assumption
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 4:05 pm 
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The difference is I have reality - (assuming you understand SEX/Procreation) on my side.
All you have are lies that attempt to make sexual deviation "natural."
Tell me how many children have been created by 2 men... or 2 women... NONE.
How many children have been created by a father and mother - ALL children - every one of 7+ billion people.
It's because homosexuality is not natural - Nature discriminates against homosexual couples by denying them procreation.
But instead of accepting this, you want to shoot the messenger.

You both have followed the brainwashing of the homosexual agenda...

"Thus propagandistic advertising can depict all opponents of the gay movement as homophobic bigots who are 'not Christian' and the propaganda can further show them as being criticized, hated and shunned"....

"Our effect is achieved without reference to facts, logic or proof.... the person's beliefs can be altered whether he is conscious of the attack or not".


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 Post subject: Re: disorder of assumption
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 4:27 pm 
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Amore wrote:
The difference is I have reality - (assuming you understand SEX/Procreation) on my side.
All you have are lies that attempt to make sexual deviation "natural."
Tell me how many children have been created by 2 men... or 2 women... NONE.
It's because homosexuality is not natural - Nature discriminates against homosexual couples by denying them procreation.
But instead of accepting this, you want to shoot the messenger.

You both have followed the brainwashing of the homosexual agenda...

"Thus propagandistic advertising can depict all opponents of the gay movement as homophobic bigots who are 'not Christian' and the propaganda can further show them as being criticized, hated and shunned"....

"Our effect is achieved without reference to facts, logic or proof.... the person's beliefs can be altered whether he is conscious of the attack or not".


No, you don't have reality. You have religious propaganda that you pretend is reality. Just for starters, there is no entity called "nature." "Nature" doesn't reward or punish. Your description of nature as "discriminating" against homosexuals is a rationalization you employ to justify your own discrimination.

Likewise, by any commonsense understanding of the term, homosexuality is "natural." It occurs throughout nature. Yet, you twist the definition of "natural" to make yourself feel good about your hatred of homosexuals.

My eating a hamburger doesn't produce children, either. The fact that any specific act cannot produce children does not make it unnatural. That sex can produce children does not mean that sex that doesn't produce children is unnatural, deviant, mental illness, etc. That is your own mental construct that you use to justify your hate and convince yourself that your hate is really love.

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 Post subject: Re: disorder of assumption
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 4:29 pm 
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If you think it is not reality that you and I and every other human being was created by a mother and father, you need more educating than I thought.

"Heterosexual love is the default pawn, while everything that expands from this, out of sexual curiosity, is an artificial pawn. Everything that spawns from heterosexuality is to be scrutinized with critical observation to conclude whether or not this perversion can remain without becoming a problem or an error in our system of living.

Loving someone else's fecal matter does not affect the world, because it remains a personal sexual interest behind closed doors (although, I'm sure if you were to turn down one fetish, there will be other fetishes that will turn right up.) Pedophilia, and homosexuals have to affect the world to act on their alleged sexual orientation. When really, their love is as baseless as their argument. As long as they do not provide a reasonable argument that accounts for their actions and the consequences that follow those actions, I will not agree with someone who has the same exact argument a child that believes in mother goose, santa clause or any other faux pas epistemological theory that only drives you to one conclusion: they have no grounds to stand on. Homosexuals stick out like a sore thumb, sir. Perhaps that is because they are making more noise than they should, while heterosexual people are living mutually in harmony with nature and life at its fundamental level. Is it not obvious to you that the perversions of the fundamentally intimate system is a cry for attention and being 'special'? Why do you think that they herd like sheep? It is all about Mankind's love for any war or battle. It is all about themselves, while some try to pretend that their love is real when as long as they have no argument, and it feels like I am talking to a ghost with no mind at all...people that really think that their love for the same sex should be aggrandized, while every other fetish remains at a casual and respectful level of renown.
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 Post subject: Re: disorder of assumption
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 4:36 pm 
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Amore wrote:
If you think it is not reality that you and I and every other human being was created by a mother and father, you need more educating than I thought.

"Heterosexual love is the default pawn, while everything that expands from this, out of sexual curiosity, is an artificial pawn. Everything that spawns from heterosexuality is to be scrutinized with critical observation to conclude whether or not this perversion can remain without becoming a problem or an error in our system of living.

Loving someone else's fecal matter does not affect the world, because it remains a personal sexual interest behind closed doors (although, I'm sure if you were to turn down one fetish, there will be other fetishes that will turn right up.) Pedophilia, and homosexuals have to affect the world to act on their alleged sexual orientation. When really, their love is as baseless as their argument. As long as they do not provide a reasonable argument that accounts for their actions and the consequences that follow those actions, I will not agree with someone who has the same exact argument a child that believes in mother goose, santa clause or any other faux pas epistemological theory that only drives you to one conclusion: they have no grounds to stand on. Homosexuals stick out like a sore thumb, sir. Perhaps that is because they are making more noise than they should, while heterosexual people are living mutually in harmony with nature and life at its fundamental level. Is it not obvious to you that the perversions of the fundamentally intimate system is a cry for attention and being 'special'? Why do you think that they herd like sheep? It is all about Mankind's love for any war or battle. It is all about themselves, while some try to pretend that their love is real when as long as they have no argument, and it feels like I am talking to a ghost with no mind at all, I am not going to affiliate with people that really think that their love for the same sex should be aggrandized, while every other fetish remains at a casual and respectful level of renown.
"


Why, yes, I was created by the combining of a sperm cell and an egg cell. Now explain to me how that fact justifies your hatred of homosexuals?

The more of this hatred you quote, the more you out yourself as the bigot you are.

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 Post subject: Re: disorder of assumption
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 4:48 pm 
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Brad,
You keep engaging in logical fallacy, and if we were on a forum of ignorant people, they may take your word for it, but my sense is that people on this forum tend to be more questioning of such logical fallacies.
If you had anything more substantial to share, you'd share it, but obviously, you don't - so you're just left with engaging in ad hominem attacks.

Why do you keep proving this??...
"Thus propagandistic advertising can depict all opponents of the gay movement as homophobic bigots who are 'not Christian' and the propaganda can further show them as being criticized, hated and shunned"....

"Our effect is achieved without reference to facts, logic or proof.... the person's beliefs can be altered whether he is conscious of the attack or not".




The following is a response to the post (I reposted above) about the double standard in Transgendered and Jack Sparrow/character identities...

"I agree with you that there is an illogical, unequal and unfair bias toward certain select individuals and groups in the current "accepting people for who they are" trend. I think it's just because people want to feel like they're being caring and empathetic toward others. They want to feel good about themselves which is a normal Human desire.

However, the "acceptors" aren't really accepting people for who the "acceptee" people think they are, they are accepting people for who the "acceptors" think they are. There is a massive difference between those two conditions.

Alas, they are merely engaging in the same exclusionary tactics that once excluded the groups they now supposedly embrace, they are just using societal undercurrents as an excuse to be gratuitously selective. I say "supposedly" because I just don't believe that they fundamentally embrace these people since there is a basic inability for them to embrace others who are exhibiting the exact same "being who they naturally are" traits. It's merely a type of superficial acceptance for the sake of appearances, social conformism and self-serving feel-goodism.

They will make absurd excuses and they will attempt to distort the principles of your point in order to protect their own emotional interests in feeling like they're on the correct side of things. It's Human nature to want to be right. Humans are generally followers."


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 Post subject: Re: disorder of assumption
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 5:11 pm 
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Amore wrote:
Brad,
You keep engaging in logical fallacy, and if we were on a forum of ignorant people, they may take your word for it, but my sense is that people on this forum tend to be more questioning of such logical fallacies.
If you had anything more substantial to share, you'd share it, but obviously, you don't - so you're just left with engaging in ad hominem attacks.

Why do you keep proving this??...
"Thus propagandistic advertising can depict all opponents of the gay movement as homophobic bigots who are 'not Christian' and the propaganda can further show them as being criticized, hated and shunned"....

"Our effect is achieved without reference to facts, logic or proof.... the person's beliefs can be altered whether he is conscious of the attack or not".




The following is a response to the post (I reposted above) about the double standard in Transgendered and Jack Sparrow/character identities...

"I agree with you that there is an illogical, unequal and unfair bias toward certain select individuals and groups in the current "accepting people for who they are" trend. I think it's just because people want to feel like they're being caring and empathetic toward others. They want to feel good about themselves which is a normal Human desire.

However, the "acceptors" aren't really accepting people for who the "acceptee" people think they are, they are accepting people for who the "acceptors" think they are. There is a massive difference between those two conditions.

Alas, they are merely engaging in the same exclusionary tactics that once excluded the groups they now supposedly embrace, they are just using societal undercurrents as an excuse to be gratuitously selective. I say "supposedly" because I just don't believe that they fundamentally embrace these people since there is a basic inability for them to embrace others who are exhibiting the exact same "being who they naturally are" traits. It's merely a type of superficial acceptance for the sake of appearances, social conformism and self-serving feel-goodism.

They will make absurd excuses and they will attempt to distort the principles of your point in order to protect their own emotional interests in feeling like they're on the correct side of things. It's Human nature to want to be right. Humans are generally followers."


What logical fallacy? Identify it. I'll address it.

I'm more than happy to talk logical fallacies. Can you name the one that you just quoted at length? You've been committing it throughout this thread.

by the way -- your author is talking out of his ass. He has no reliable way of telling whether I or anyone else accepts gay people for who they are or not. It's a nice story that he is telling you to help you feel good about yourself. But there is no reason whatsoever to believe that it corresponds to reality.

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 Post subject: Re: disorder of assumption
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 5:16 pm 
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Amore wrote:
Tell me how many children have been created by 2 men... or 2 women... NONE.
How many children have been created by a father and mother - ALL children - every one of 7+ billion people.


Just passing through, but I thought I'd mention that the ability for two people to create children between themselves has never been a requirement for granting a marriage license. I hope that this argument is not being used for that purpose.


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