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 Post subject: Re: Museum of the Bible opening
PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2018 8:17 am 
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LittleNipper wrote:
FRIDAY, FEBRUARY 16, 2007
How Giraffe Got his long Neck

Darwin was the first to propose that long necks evolved in giraffes because they enabled the animals to eat foliage beyond the reach of shorter browsers. That seemingly sensible explanation has held up for over a century, but it is probably wrong, says Robert Simmons. Simmons, a behavioral ecologist at the Ministry of Environment and Tourism in Windhoek, Namibia, believes giraffes developed long necks not to compete for food but to win mates. Simmons was studying eagles in Sabi Sand Reserve in South Africa when he happened to come upon a pair of male giraffes locked in combat. Male giraffes battle for mates by swinging their powerful necks--which can be over six feet long and weigh more than 200 pounds. The momentum generated allows them to slam their heads into their opponents with vertebrae-shattering--and occasionally lethal--force. In these contests, males with the longest, thickest necks usually prevail. As Simmons watched the fight, he became convinced that this competition for mates, not stretching for treetop food, was what drove the evolution of the neck. If competition for food had spurred the elongation, says Simmons, then you would expect giraffes to graze mainly from tall acacia trees beyond the reach of other savanna inhabitants. But giraffes feed mostly with their necks bent, along low bushes. Moreover, their short, stubby horns probably evolved to better concentrate the force of their head blows.


Nice to see you promoting evolution, Nipper, but this example would probably fall under Lysenkoism, which was disproved in the last century. :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: Museum of the Bible opening
PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:38 am 
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Maksutov wrote:
LittleNipper wrote:
How Giraffe Got his long Neck
--- snip
Nice to see you promoting evolution, Nipper, but this example would probably fall under Lysenkoism, which was disproved in the last century. :wink:


LittleNipper wrote:
Darwin was the first to propose that long necks evolved in giraffes because they enabled the animals to eat foliage beyond the reach of shorter browsers. That seemingly sensible explanation has held up for over a century

The flat earth was held up for millenia...
LittleNipper wrote:
but it is probably wrong
But it is definitely wrong (the flat earth...).

The science begins with the observed - observable - facts.
These are all the questions about facts. How? Which way? Why?
Then the answers? Their name is legion, for they are many. (a paraphrase of Mark 5:9)
Most of the answers were abandoned at first sight.
Some are - were, will be - valid for centuries or millenia. After it, dropped by a better answer. Science works this way.

LittleNipper wrote:
a behavioral ecologist at the Ministry of Environment and Tourism in Windhoek, Namibia
... an expert ... Ministry of Tourism ...
Forget it, I am a heckler.

LittleNipper wrote:
... giraffes developed long necks not to compete for food but to win mates.
OK, I got it.
Giraffes didn't have a special cage in Noah's ark - for their long necks, but they developed it by evolution.
Not for more eating, but for more copulation. --- And, as side effects, this is working for the carrying on the species.
Seems to be acceptable. The urge to make love is stronger that hunger.
mating giraffes here NOT nfsw...



LittleNipper wrote:
Simmons was studying eagles in Sabi Sand Reserve in South Africa when he happened to come upon a pair of male giraffes locked in combat. Male giraffes battle for mates by swinging their powerful necks--which can be over six feet long and weigh more than 200 pounds. The momentum generated allows them to slam their heads into their opponents with vertebrae-shattering--and occasionally lethal--force. In these contests, males with the longest, thickest necks usually prevail. As Simmons watched the fight, he became convinced that this competition for mates, not stretching for treetop food, was what drove the evolution of the neck. If competition for food had spurred the elongation, says Simmons, then you would expect giraffes to graze mainly from tall acacia trees beyond the reach of other savanna inhabitants. But giraffes feed mostly with their necks bent, along low bushes. Moreover, their short, stubby horns probably evolved to better concentrate the force of their head blows.
Summary:
You accept the evolution (& abandon creation, at least about giraffes).
""competition for mates, not stretching for treetop food, was what drove the evolution of the neck""

I am OK.
The evolution works - by You -, even we - sometimes - don't know the exact causes.
Meantime, there were on the Noah's ark zebroides, which have became short necked giraffes - evolved to those we know today.

What about blinded amphibians and crayfishes, today living in caves?
Did they overlived the deluge in Noah's mini caves, then crawled back to their home cave with the help of their guide dogs?

Or the evolution helped them to forget unnecessary organs as eyes?

Just asking.

by the way
SAVE THE GIRAFFES.

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 Post subject: Re: Museum of the Bible opening
PostPosted: Thu Feb 22, 2018 8:40 pm 
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NO, I'm just showing Darwin the Father of Evolution to not know what he was writing about.


Last edited by LittleNipper on Fri Feb 23, 2018 10:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Museum of the Bible opening
PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 1:49 am 
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LittleNipper wrote:
NO, I just showing Darwin the Father of Evolution to not know what he was writing about.

Darwin didn't write scripture. (I should write that word as Scripture...)

Every biologist - today - know his errors, and his correct conclusions.
Who were who selected them? Other scientists. Science works this way, nobody expects to know what science is - from You, from a preacher.


Who did show - in or out of Your Sacred Scripts (written millenials ago...), that

--- coney and hare doesn't " cheweth the cud"
Quote:
Leviticus 11
5. And the coney, because he cheweth the cud, but divideth not the hoof; he is unclean unto you.
6. And the hare, because he cheweth the cud, but divideth not the hoof; he is unclean unto you.

--- nobody can cure the leper with killed birds:
Quote:
Leviticus 14
2. This shall be the law of the leper in the day of his cleansing: He shall be brought unto the priest:
3. And the priest shall go forth out of the camp; and the priest shall look, and, behold, if the plague of leprosy be healed in the leper;
4. Then shall the priest command to take for him that is to be cleansed two birds alive and clean, and cedar wood, and scarlet, and hyssop:
5. And the priest shall command that one of the birds be killed in an earthen vessel over running water:
6. As for the living bird, he shall take it, and the cedar wood, and the scarlet, and the hyssop, and shall dip them and the living bird in the blood of the bird that was killed over the running water:
7. And he shall sprinkle upon him that is to be cleansed from the leprosy seven times, and shall pronounce him clean, and shall let the living bird loose into the open field.
Quintessential stupidity...

--- Even from an exceeding high mountain, nobody can see all the kingdoms of the world, neither the glory of them.
Quote:
Matthew 4
8. Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them;
As You probably know - I am not certain that... - our world is a globe.


I just showing to You that Moses and Matthew did not know what he was writing about.
And no prophet, seer, revelator or littlenipper dare say that they are erred...

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 Post subject: Re: Museum of the Bible opening
PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 10:24 am 
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The leper was indeed ALREADY cured and the priest at that point was to perform a sacrifice representing the purification of his soul. Lepers were not allowed near the temple, so a cured leper was being allowed to rejoin the community as a CLEAN individual...

Jesus was taken up a high mountain there is no mention that what was shown Jesus was even visible from the top of that mountain. Satan likely conjured up images from around the entire globe. I mean that I can certainly visit all the kingdoms of the world from in front of my computer --- even ancient ones like Rome and Greece. I'm quite sure Satan being an angel in control of the earth had/has such abilities.

Did you know that rabbits will consume their own select pellets (poop) and chew on them to get as much nurishment out of them as possible. And that insects will use their front appendages as we would arms and hands to grasp and groom? (I'm step ahead of you there) Who is being too literal now!

However, the Hebrew phrase for ‘chew the cud’ simply means ‘raising up what has been swallowed’. Coneys and rabbits go through such similar motions to ruminants that Linnaeus, the father of modern classification (and a creationist), at first classified them as ruminants.

Rabbits and hares practise refection, which is essentially the same principle as rumination, and does indeed ‘raise up what has been swallowed’. The food goes right through the rabbit and is passed out as a special type of dropping. These are re-eaten, and can now nourish the rabbit as they have already been partly digested.


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 Post subject: Re: Museum of the Bible opening
PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 11:51 am 
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I always get a chuckle watching religious fundamentalist attack science using a computer.

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 Post subject: Re: Museum of the Bible opening
PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 12:14 pm 
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LittleNipper wrote:
Did you know that rabbits will consume their own select pellets (poop) and chew on them to get as much nurishment out of them as possible. And that insects will use their front appendages as we would arms and hands to grasp and groom? (I'm step ahead of you there) Who is being too literal now!

However, the Hebrew phrase for ‘chew the cud’ simply means ‘raising up what has been swallowed’. Coneys and rabbits go through such similar motions to ruminants that Linnaeus, the father of modern classification (and a creationist), at first classified them as ruminants.

Rabbits and hares practise refection, which is essentially the same principle as rumination, and does indeed ‘raise up what has been swallowed’. The food goes right through the rabbit and is passed out as a special type of dropping. These are re-eaten, and can now nourish the rabbit as they have already been partly digested.


I'm sure that I must be missing something, Nipper. What is it you're trying to say here that has to do with the Bible, or museums, or Museums of the Bible?


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 Post subject: Re: Museum of the Bible opening
PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 4:11 pm 
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Maksutov wrote:
I've never quite figured out the status of the JST. Why are the Saints packing around KJVs when the JST is around? :lol:

I think I’m going to start referring to the quad as the quint.

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 Post subject: Re: Museum of the Bible opening
PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 4:14 pm 
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LittleNipper wrote:
NO, I'm just showing Darwin the Father of Evolution to not know what he was writing about.

So, giraffes evolved differently than Darwin thought, . . . but you still admit that they evolved.

That's quite the refutation of Darwin.

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 Post subject: Re: Museum of the Bible opening
PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 4:14 pm 
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Morley wrote:
LittleNipper wrote:
Did you know that rabbits will consume their own select pellets (poop) and chew on them to get as much nurishment out of them as possible. And that insects will use their front appendages as we would arms and hands to grasp and groom? (I'm step ahead of you there) Who is being too literal now!

However, the Hebrew phrase for ‘chew the cud’ simply means ‘raising up what has been swallowed’. Coneys and rabbits go through such similar motions to ruminants that Linnaeus, the father of modern classification (and a creationist), at first classified them as ruminants.

Rabbits and hares practise refection, which is essentially the same principle as rumination, and does indeed ‘raise up what has been swallowed’. The food goes right through the rabbit and is passed out as a special type of dropping. These are re-eaten, and can now nourish the rabbit as they have already been partly digested.


I'm sure that I must be missing something, Nipper. What is it you're trying to say here that has to do with the Bible, or museums, or Museums of the Bible?


He just copied and pasted something. He doesn't read it first. :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Museum of the Bible opening
PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 2:44 pm 
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Morley wrote:
LittleNipper wrote:
Did you know that rabbits will consume their own select pellets (poop) and chew on them to get as much nurishment out of them as possible. And that insects will use their front appendages as we would arms and hands to grasp and groom? (I'm step ahead of you there) Who is being too literal now!

However, the Hebrew phrase for ‘chew the cud’ simply means ‘raising up what has been swallowed’. Coneys and rabbits go through such similar motions to ruminants that Linnaeus, the father of modern classification (and a creationist), at first classified them as ruminants.

Rabbits and hares practise refection, which is essentially the same principle as rumination, and does indeed ‘raise up what has been swallowed’. The food goes right through the rabbit and is passed out as a special type of dropping. These are re-eaten, and can now nourish the rabbit as they have already been partly digested.


I'm sure that I must be missing something, Nipper. What is it you're trying to say here that has to do with the Bible, or museums, or Museums of the Bible?

I was answering Paracelsus' questions regarding supposed Biblical error. It seems there are none... :ugeek:


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 Post subject: Re: Museum of the Bible opening
PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 2:52 pm 
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Fence Sitter wrote:
I always get a chuckle watching religious fundamentalist attack science using a computer.
Fundamentalists do not in fact attack science, what they fight are secular mistakes in both reasoning and translating data.


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 Post subject: Re: Museum of the Bible opening
PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 4:53 pm 
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LittleNipper wrote:
Did you know that rabbits will consume their own select pellets (poop) and chew on them to get as much nurishment out of them as possible. And that insects will use their front appendages as we would arms and hands to grasp and groom? (I'm step ahead of you there) Who is being too literal now!

However, the Hebrew phrase for ‘chew the cud’ simply means ‘raising up what has been swallowed’. Coneys and rabbits go through such similar motions to ruminants that Linnaeus, the father of modern classification (and a creationist), at first classified them as ruminants.
Rabbits and hares practise refection, which is essentially the same principle as rumination, and does indeed ‘raise up what has been swallowed’. The food goes right through the rabbit and is passed out as a special type of dropping. These are re-eaten, and can now nourish the rabbit as they have already been partly digested.

Morley wrote:
I'm sure that I must be missing something, Nipper. What is it you're trying to say here that has to do with the Bible, or museums, or Museums of the Bible?

LittleNipper wrote:
I was answering Paracelsus' questions regarding supposed Biblical error. It seems there are none... :ugeek:


He didn't say anything about rabbits. You seem to have just randomly started sharing trivia about them.


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 Post subject: Re: Museum of the Bible opening
PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 4:54 pm 
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Which, as you say, proves the Bible or something.


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 Post subject: Re: Museum of the Bible opening
PostPosted: Sun Feb 25, 2018 3:58 pm 
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Maksutov wrote:
[T]his example would probably fall under Lysenkoism, which was disproved in the last century.

I don't think so. Simmons has a perfectly Darwinian theory of long giraffe necks. He just thinks the reproductive advantage of long necks lay in headbutting rival males, rather than in getting more food from higher branches.

My question for Simmons would be whether female giraffes also headbutt. I'd be surprised if they did, because the neck-swinging headbutt sounds like an attack that only really works well against other giraffes, and I don't think the females would need to fight off rival females to get the best males. Males have enough to go round.

If females don't need long necks for fighting, and fighting is the main app for long necks, then I'd have expected long necks to be restricted to males, the way big antlers are in most deer species. A web page tells me that male giraffes do have somewhat longer necks than females, even in proportion to their overall larger body size. So maybe fighting has driven the extra length of male giraffes' necks. Female giraffe necks are still awfully long, though.


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 Post subject: Re: Museum of the Bible opening
PostPosted: Sun Feb 25, 2018 9:42 pm 
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Morley wrote:
LittleNipper wrote:
Did you know that rabbits will consume their own select pellets (poop) and chew on them to get as much nurishment out of them as possible. And that insects will use their front appendages as we would arms and hands to grasp and groom? (I'm step ahead of you there) Who is being too literal now!

However, the Hebrew phrase for ‘chew the cud’ simply means ‘raising up what has been swallowed’. Coneys and rabbits go through such similar motions to ruminants that Linnaeus, the father of modern classification (and a creationist), at first classified them as ruminants.
Rabbits and hares practise refection, which is essentially the same principle as rumination, and does indeed ‘raise up what has been swallowed’. The food goes right through the rabbit and is passed out as a special type of dropping. These are re-eaten, and can now nourish the rabbit as they have already been partly digested.

Morley wrote:
I'm sure that I must be missing something, Nipper. What is it you're trying to say here that has to do with the Bible, or museums, or Museums of the Bible?

LittleNipper wrote:
I was answering Paracelsus' questions regarding supposed Biblical error. It seems there are none... :ugeek:


He didn't say anything about rabbits. You seem to have just randomly started sharing trivia about them.
Coney is also translated rabbit.


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 Post subject: Re: Museum of the Bible opening
PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2018 2:55 am 
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LittleNipper wrote:
Coney is also translated rabbit.


You got me. Apologies.


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 Post subject: Re: Museum of the Bible opening
PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2018 10:15 am 
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LittleNipper wrote:
Fence Sitter wrote:
I always get a chuckle watching religious fundamentalist attack science using a computer.
Fundamentalists do not in fact attack science, what they fight are secular mistakes in both reasoning and translating data.


A distinction without a difference.

When you attack evolution you attack a variety of other sciences as well as the scientific method, but keep using that computer because I am sure somehow the scientist and engineers developing computer are just better at "reasoning and translating data" than biologist, virologist, geologist, archaeologist, paleontologist, climatologist, astronomers, physicist, and so on.

Or is it just evolution and geology that somehow are wrong even though their results are verified throughout a variety of different fields and using the same basic methodology?

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 Post subject: Re: Museum of the Bible opening
PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2018 8:23 pm 
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Fence Sitter wrote:
LittleNipper wrote:

A distinction without a difference.

When you attack evolution you attack a variety of other sciences as well as the scientific method, but keep using that computer because I am sure somehow the scientist and engineers developing computer are just better at "reasoning and translating data" than biologist, virologist, geologist, archaeologist, paleontologist, climatologist, astronomers, physicist, and so on.

Or is it just evolution and geology that somehow are wrong even though their results are verified throughout a variety of different fields and using the same basic methodology?

When you attack the Bible you attack the supernatural. Science is purely a hands on study. Leave theory to philosophy and we will all get along.


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 Post subject: Re: Museum of the Bible opening
PostPosted: Tue Feb 27, 2018 9:17 am 
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LittleNipper wrote:
Leave theory to philosophy and we will all get along.
Say, did you ever notice that when you let go of something it tends to move downward? I wonder why that is. I'll have to dig out my Plato.


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 Post subject: Re: Museum of the Bible opening
PostPosted: Tue Feb 27, 2018 9:40 am 
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LittleNipper wrote:
When you attack the Bible you attack the supernatural. Science is purely a hands on study. Leave theory to philosophy and we will all get along.


I am not attacking THE Bible.

I am denying your presumptuous arrogant claims to tell others what it means and to act as if some god agrees with you.

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