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 Post subject: Re: Atheism Continues to Be Misunderstood - Is This Delibera
PostPosted: Tue Feb 27, 2018 7:59 pm 
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Jersey Girl wrote:
I'm not clear why the term "herd mentality" is being applied to atheists. Are you guys sure this isn't a reference to common world views? If so, how is that herd mentality?

Herd mentality or group thought is when people are influenced by others... which creates a bunch of people thinking the same which tends to be less logical than independent thought.

Atheism is not independent thought because there is no one word to properly define independent thought. The word, “Atheism” literally means “without theism” yet there are many books on Atheism and how “you too, can be an independent thinker like us!” :) Here are +400 books on A-theism: https://www.goodreads.com/list/show/27. ... eist_Books

Atheists tend to base their unified thought on the rejection of organized religion. Yet, consider the many Atheist organizations...
A long list... http://www.atheistsites.net


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 Post subject: Re: Atheism Continues to Be Misunderstood - Is This Delibera
PostPosted: Tue Feb 27, 2018 11:10 pm 
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Amore wrote:
yet there are many books on Atheism and how “you too, can be an independent thinker like us!” :) Here are +400 books on A-theism: https://www.goodreads.com/list/show/27. ... eist_Books

Atheists tend to base their unified thought on the rejection of organized religion. Yet, consider the many Atheist organizations...
A long list... http://www.atheistsites.net


A lot of people I know simply don't believe in god, and they don't bother to read books about it nor do they join organizations of atheists, they just spend their lives getting out of the sites of the theists.


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 Post subject: Re: Atheism Continues to Be Misunderstood - Is This Delibera
PostPosted: Tue Feb 27, 2018 11:21 pm 
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Amore wrote:
Res Ipsa wrote:
Doc, Amore doesn’t use herd mentality to describe all groups, so I’m not understanding what she means.

How long have you had the delusion you could read minds?

If you’d bother to read what I wrote, you’d know what I meant - unless comprehension is not your strong suit.


But you never articulated an example of atheist heard mentality, where are the fruits of heard mentality among atheists? We've seen it in gangs, (shootings, crime, drugs)in theists, (enslavement, crusades, witch hunts) in military regimes, (progroms, disappearing)? Where are these fruits in atheism?


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 Post subject: Re: Atheism Continues to Be Misunderstood - Is This Delibera
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 7:28 am 
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Perhaps this isn't what Amore means, but it seems to me that the way she is using group think reflects the hipster version of it. That being, because she is privy to the modes and paths of thinking that she has experienced, she recognizes the nuances and variety in her thinking from whatever it is that served as the original foundation. With this wholly subjective understanding of her own mind, she feels comfortable in her view that her thoughts are the product of independent thought as in her mind she is the author of the final product. If some of the content is cited works by others, so to speak, it doesn't make it the result of group think but instead simply the ground level thinking upon which she built. The more outside of her realm of self-understanding a person is, the further they are from her own experience of authoring her worldview, while the most objective way she understands them is via the common foundational beliefs they share. Without access to their minds, what seems apparent is that they are sharing someone else's beliefs to a large extent.

Thus -

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 Post subject: Re: Atheism Continues to Be Misunderstood - Is This Delibera
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 9:22 am 
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 Post subject: Re: Atheism Continues to Be Misunderstood - Is This Delibera
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 9:47 am 
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subgenius wrote:
to claim that atheism exists or is true only concludes with the inescapable truth that there is no individuality, no free will, and no ability to be actually be an autonomous person capable of original thought. Atheism requires original thought to be nothing more than an illusion.


You would do well for yourself if you learned a little philosophy, then you might spout a little less BS. :redface:

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 Post subject: Re: Atheism Continues to Be Misunderstood - Is This Delibera
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 10:00 am 
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Amore wrote:
That’s partly why I dislike labels. Just by labeling your beliefs suggests some type of group thought. If you’re an independent thinker, how could you pick a single word to describe your beliefs?


Independent thinking it not about whether one uses one word to describe their beliefs. People do that because that may be all they have time for, or all one is asking. The problem is other people taking it to far. I don't assume a person who says they are a theist is a Christian or believes in one God. I wouldn't also assume a person who says they are atheist thinks they know for certain Gods do not exist.

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Herd mentality or group thought is when people are influenced by others... which creates a bunch of people thinking the same which tends to be less logical than independent thought.


We are all influenced by others. Most of what we think is not original to us. That does not make one guilty of herd mentality. We are guilty of it if we just go with whatever the group thinks or does without questioning if it is right. One can be an independent thinker and be an atheist, theist, or agnostic. They can belong to one or many different groups. Independent thinking is more about understanding our group may not have it right, and be willing to change our beliefs.

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 Post subject: Re: Atheism Continues to Be Misunderstood - Is This Delibera
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 10:06 am 
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If Amore is to be used as a case study - then yes it is deliberate.

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 Post subject: Re: Atheism Continues to Be Misunderstood - Is This Delibera
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 12:16 pm 
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Amore wrote:
Res Ipsa wrote:
Doc, Amore doesn’t use herd mentality to describe all groups, so I’m not understanding what she means.

How long have you had the delusion you could read minds?

If you’d bother to read what I wrote, you’d know what I meant - unless comprehension is not your strong suit.


Nothing I said purported to read your mind. You use the term “herd mentality” here to refer to some groups but not others. I didn’t think you’d described what exactly you mean by “atheist herd mentality”, so that’s why I asked. If you think you did so upthread, would you mind quoting the portion where you did?

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 Post subject: Re: Atheism Continues to Be Misunderstood - Is This Delibera
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 2:15 pm 
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I suspect that whenever two or more people agree on something that Amore herself does not agree with or want to believe, she is eager to dismiss that as an example of herd mentality, no matter how strong the supporting evidence on which that agreement is based, rather than admit the possibility she might herself be mistaken.

If a particular conclusion or position is strongly corroborated by the available evidence, then the fact that a large majority (or for that matter, even a minority) of people believe it does not require or imply group mentality except in the minds those who obstinately refuse to accept inconvenient or undesirable reality.

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 Post subject: Re: Atheism Continues to Be Misunderstood - Is This Delibera
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 2:40 pm 
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I think the only reason Amore used the term "herd mentality" to describe atheists is that he/she probably heard someone use it in reference to religion (predictably), and he/she wants to turn it around on the godless. It sounds like a belated I know you are but what am I gambit.

How clever.

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 Post subject: Re: Atheism Continues to Be Misunderstood - Is This Delibera
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 3:05 pm 
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I think you have it pegged, Schmo! :cool:

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 Post subject: Re: Atheism Continues to Be Misunderstood - Is This Delibera
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2018 2:26 pm 
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Themis wrote:
Amore wrote:
That’s partly why I dislike labels. Just by labeling your beliefs suggests some type of group thought. If you’re an independent thinker, how could you pick a single word to describe your beliefs?


Independent thinking it not about whether one uses one word to describe their beliefs. People do that because that may be all they have time for, or all one is asking. The problem is other people taking it to far. I don't assume a person who says they are a theist is a Christian or believes in one God. I wouldn't also assume a person who says they are atheist thinks they know for certain Gods do not exist.

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Herd mentality or group thought is when people are influenced by others... which creates a bunch of people thinking the same which tends to be less logical than independent thought.


We are all influenced by others. Most of what we think is not original to us. That does not make one guilty of herd mentality. We are guilty of it if we just go with whatever the group thinks or does without questioning if it is right. One can be an independent thinker and be an atheist, theist, or agnostic. They can belong to one or many different groups. Independent thinking is more about understanding our group may not have it right, and be willing to change our beliefs.

Themis, you made a good point about seeing more complexity in people but using labels as generalizations. I still don’t like labels - or herd mentality - whether Theist or Atheist. Times it bothers me the most is when others gang up on one person and join in taking stabbs at them when if they met the person on the street one-on-one, they’d act very differently.


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 Post subject: Re: Atheism Continues to Be Misunderstood - Is This Delibera
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2018 2:44 pm 
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Amore wrote:
Times it bothers me the most is when others gang up on one person and join in taking stabbs at them when if they met the person on the street one-on-one, they’d act very differently.

I will speak only for myself here, but I can say without doubt that if you said to me on the street some of the things you've said in this thread, I'd tell you exactly what I said face to face.

Your comments are unoriginal; I've been here before.

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 Post subject: Re: Atheism Continues to Be Misunderstood - Is This Delibera
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2018 11:26 pm 
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You deny God 'cuz you just wanna sin

This short video exposes yet another commonly held and well documented fallacy and misunderstanding about Atheism. Theists are not, in general, statistically more moral than or even as moral as atheists, despite what most faithful theists want to believe. The most atheistic states and countries (at least in the developed world) have lower murder rates, lower teen age pregnancy rates and even lower abortion rates than the most religious.

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 Post subject: Re: Atheism Continues to Be Misunderstood - Is This Delibera
PostPosted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 11:19 am 
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Amore wrote:


Themis, you made a good point about seeing more complexity in people but using labels as generalizations. I still don’t like labels - or herd mentality - whether Theist or Atheist. Times it bothers me the most is when others gang up on one person and join in taking stabbs at them when if they met the person on the street one-on-one, they’d act very differently.


The problem is, you only seem to object to labels when they are negative and are applied to you. You seem to have no problem applying negative labels to others.

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 Post subject: Re: Atheism Continues to Be Misunderstood - Is This Delibera
PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 6:31 pm 
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Some Schmo wrote:
Amore wrote:
Times it bothers me the most is when others gang up on one person and join in taking stabbs at them when if they met the person on the street one-on-one, they’d act very differently.

I will speak only for myself here, but I can say without doubt that if you said to me on the street some of the things you've said in this thread, I'd tell you exactly what I said face to face.

Your comments are unoriginal; I've been here before.

I should hope you understood basic anatomy.


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 Post subject: Re: Atheism Continues to Be Misunderstood - Is This Delibera
PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 6:33 pm 
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Res Ipsa wrote:
Amore wrote:
Themis, you made a good point about seeing more complexity in people but using labels as generalizations. I still don’t like labels - or herd mentality - whether Theist or Atheist. Times it bothers me the most is when others gang up on one person and join in taking stabbs at them when if they met the person on the street one-on-one, they’d act very differently.

The problem is, you only seem to object to labels when they are negative and are applied to you. You seem to have no problem applying negative labels to others.

As...? Please provide at least 2 examples (as in quotes) of me doing what you accuse me of... “applying negative labels to others.”

I think you’ve been reading the BS on this forum too long and assume I communicate the same as many on here do.


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 Post subject: Re: Atheism Continues to Be Misunderstood - Is This Delibera
PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 7:06 pm 
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Amore wrote:
I still don’t like labels - or herd mentality - whether Theist or Atheist.


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 Post subject: Re: Atheism Continues to Be Misunderstood - Is This Delibera
PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 7:29 pm 
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Amore wrote:
As...? Please provide at least 2 examples (as in quotes) of me doing what you accuse me of... “applying negative labels to others.”

I think you’ve been reading the BS on this forum too long and assume I communicate the same as many on here do.


"It’s as if mentally ill people have forced their way into control. And those who have some degree of mental illness support it."

Amore wrote:
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"Homosexuality and its agenda are based on emotional reasoning logical fallacy. It pretends, “if someone FEELS it, it must be fact!” The reason why I’m convinced you have fallen for mind control is that I know you’re able to reason logically - to accept scientific facts in other contexts - except for homosexual ones."

"Trying to justify animalistic behavior as acceptable for human behavior is illogical- don’t you see that?"

"What a lost mental state to be in - to be controlled by others’ particular sets of emotional reasoning."

"But homosedual (yes, you spelled it this way) bullies don’t care about logic - their foundation is vased on logical fallacies like emotional reasoning."

"Mind control systematically applied - even better than Mormonism!"

"The homosexual and leftists are AGAINST FREE SPEECH."

"while people with homosexual preferences get a pass on even some of the most dysfunctional behavior - like suing others for not supporting their deviant sexual preferences."

"Thank you for giving me an example of EXACTLY how homosexual fanatics are insanely based on emotional reasoning and other logical fallacies like ad hominem attack."

"Homosexuality is sickness."

"you’re obviously a Lookist engaging in Lookism since you judged that couple by looking at them! No, I won’t fall for the mind control."

"amore, you are a bigoted twat who needs to get a life. Im sorry your life sucks so bad that you feel the need to criticize others for how they choose to live their lives but damn, you just look pathetic and needy. Buck up, try educating yourself with materials that don't confirm your gross bigotry and stop being such a loser..." - oh wait, sorry this was me.

Well, that challenge was easy and I only had to go to a couple pages of one thread to show what a clueless hypocrite you are. by the way, you are still a disgusting human being. No offense...

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 Post subject: Re: Atheism Continues to Be Misunderstood - Is This Delibera
PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 9:08 pm 
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Ok - one meme referring to snowflakes.

The rest are referring to behavior that statistically or otherwise proves to be harmful. Only those who are so engulfed by emotional reasoning and identity politics cannot tell the difference between a person and their behavior.


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