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 Post subject: Re: Church reports fewest congregations in the UK since 1991
PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2018 9:47 am 
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JLHPROF wrote:
Craig Paxton wrote:
The trends are clearly not headed in a direction that favors the church...


Were we expecting a continual increase?


No, no the Organization was not. There is purpose in calling those who join the Organization "mine elect". Certainly such a statement precludes the thought of increase beyond the natural expansion due to birth of a "Royal Generation".

Clearly the Sales efforts of the Organization is solely to put the next generation of devoted through the "Refiners Fire", thus enabling them to demonstrate commitment and obedience.

Well done followers of Mormon Jesus and Horny Holy Joe. You have truly extracted the inhabitants of Mormon heaven from this Evil World. Now if only Mormon Jesus would stop ____ them celestial bitches and Return to his Earthly Glory.

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 Post subject: Re: Church reports fewest congregations in the UK since 1991
PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2018 10:03 am 
God
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This is such an american church that I wonder if america's decline in popularity has something to do with the decline in popularity of america's church? When I was down in Brazil, the people we baptized worshiped america and americans. Those who were tired of america's meddling with the government viewed us with distain. A world poll taken in 2015 said that the United States was the greatest threat to world peace. I wonder if this will hasten the decline? https://www.alternet.org/news-amp-politics/1-threat-peace-world-guess-who-its-us

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 Post subject: Re: Church reports fewest congregations in the UK since 1991
PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2018 10:13 am 
1st Quorum of Seventy

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Exiled wrote:
This is such an american church that I wonder if america's decline in popularity has something to do with the decline in popularity of america's church? When I was down in Brazil, the people we baptized worshiped america and americans. Those who were tired of america's meddling with the government viewed us with distain. A world poll taken in 2015 said that the United States was the greatest threat to world peace. I wonder if this will hasten the decline? https://www.alternet.org/news-amp-politics/1-threat-peace-world-guess-who-its-us


Well I can't find it but someone here some months back suggested that is why Africa has seen such growth over the past 10-20 years--they associate America with wealth and so getting connected to an American religion meant a possibility to get more money, by at the very least making American connections.


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 Post subject: Re: Church reports fewest congregations in the UK since 1991
PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2018 10:24 am 
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Exiled wrote:
This is such an american church that I wonder if america's decline in popularity has something to do with the decline in popularity of america's church? When I was down in Brazil, the people we baptized worshiped america and americans. Those who were tired of america's meddling with the government viewed us with distain. A world poll taken in 2015 said that the United States was the greatest threat to world peace. I wonder if this will hasten the decline? https://www.alternet.org/news-amp-politics/1-threat-peace-world-guess-who-its-us

This is something that is really interesting. It may have a lot to do with religion in America.


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 Post subject: Re: Church reports fewest congregations in the UK since 1991
PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2018 10:51 am 
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I've been interested for a while in seeing if there is a correlation between the rise of america after WWII and the growth of Mormonism as well as the growth of other american style religions in other countries. It seems there is one. America's rise after WWII brought a cultural dominance with it. Hollywood sent its movies all over and American products dominated. In the 1950's, I think American corporations controlled around 50% of the world GDP. American corporations no longer dominate as corporations in general have become more world-centric. I think people resent America for its warmongering now and associating Mormonism with America could prove to be tough on convert numbers, if not already. I wonder how Romney and the so-called Mormon moment plays in all of this? Maybe shining a light on Mormonism and having a Mormon run for president of the country most likely to destroy peace was the exact wrong thing to do?

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 Post subject: Re: Church reports fewest congregations in the UK since 1991
PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2018 12:26 pm 
Savior (resurrected)

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Exiled wrote:
I've been interested for a while in seeing if there is a correlation between the rise of america after WWII and the growth of Mormonism as well as the growth of other american style religions in other countries. It seems there is one. America's rise after WWII brought a cultural dominance with it. Hollywood sent its movies all over and American products dominated. In the 1950's, I think American corporations controlled around 50% of the world GDP. American corporations no longer dominate as corporations in general have become more world-centric. I think people resent America for its warmongering now and associating Mormonism with America could prove to be tough on convert numbers, if not already. I wonder how Romney and the so-called Mormon moment plays in all of this? Maybe shining a light on Mormonism and having a Mormon run for president of the country most likely to destroy peace was the exact wrong thing to do?


Also, something to consider is the rural Europe way of life: villages with one, maybe two churches. Then churches in city neighborhoods. These places, their infrastructures and cultures were largely built around a horse and buggy or walking lifestyle. The drive-everywhere mentality is not as strong in Europe as in America. Mormonism does not have such a traditional hold, and being a Mormon commuter in Europe is alienating: if you live more than 15 minutes away from the chapel, as in my experience, it is more difficult and more expensive to participate. Gas is significantly more costly. Other members are less willing to visit or home teach people "far" from the chapel.


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 Post subject: Re: Church reports fewest congregations in the UK since 1991
PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2018 7:31 pm 
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Meadowchik wrote:
Also, something to consider is the rural Europe way of life: villages with one, maybe two churches. Then churches in city neighborhoods. These places, their infrastructures and cultures were largely built around a horse and buggy or walking lifestyle. The drive-everywhere mentality is not as strong in Europe as in America. Mormonism does not have such a traditional hold, and being a Mormon commuter in Europe is alienating: if you live more than 15 minutes away from the chapel, as in my experience, it is more difficult and more expensive to participate. Gas is significantly more costly. Other members are less willing to visit or home teach people "far" from the chapel.


Excellent.


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 Post subject: Re: Church reports fewest congregations in the UK since 1991
PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2018 8:14 pm 
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Meadowchik wrote:
Exiled wrote:
I've been interested for a while in seeing if there is a correlation between the rise of america after WWII and the growth of Mormonism as well as the growth of other american style religions in other countries. It seems there is one. America's rise after WWII brought a cultural dominance with it. Hollywood sent its movies all over and American products dominated. In the 1950's, I think American corporations controlled around 50% of the world GDP. American corporations no longer dominate as corporations in general have become more world-centric. I think people resent America for its warmongering now and associating Mormonism with America could prove to be tough on convert numbers, if not already. I wonder how Romney and the so-called Mormon moment plays in all of this? Maybe shining a light on Mormonism and having a Mormon run for president of the country most likely to destroy peace was the exact wrong thing to do?


Also, something to consider is the rural Europe way of life: villages with one, maybe two churches. Then churches in city neighborhoods. These places, their infrastructures and cultures were largely built around a horse and buggy or walking lifestyle. The drive-everywhere mentality is not as strong in Europe as in America. Mormonism does not have such a traditional hold, and being a Mormon commuter in Europe is alienating: if you live more than 15 minutes away from the chapel, as in my experience, it is more difficult and more expensive to participate. Gas is significantly more costly. Other members are less willing to visit or home teach people "far" from the chapel.


In Australia most members live more than 15 min drive from the chapel. Mormonism is an expensive pastime with the amount of driving required for HT, VT, youth activities, meetings etc. In my experience Salt Lake was completely oblivious to these extra challenges because all attention was focussed inside the Zion Curtain.

When I was bishop my RS president was trying to lift VT above 5% and proposed a new program where sisters got together socially with all the sisters they were to visit. They could get dozens of visits done in a single gathering. I was fine with it because it was such a good idea. But word got to our stake RSP and they contacted Salt Lake to see if it was OK. Salt Lake torpedoed it. They just couldn't let people think for themselves. This was 20 YEARS ago!!! Under the new ministering program this type of social gathering is EXACTLY what they want to see happening. Why did it take so long for the "revelation" get to the prophets?

Because they haven't got a clue and they are totally insulated from the real world.

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