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 Post subject: Powerful Presentation by Harvard Microbiologist on Cryonics
PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 11:05 pm 
God

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The reason why Terryl Givens and other trolls like him believe in the pascal's wager is because they are afraid of death. Mormonism and religion promise a happy afterlife, so wishful thinking completely dominates "intellectual" Mormons.

Harvard Medical school graduate Dr. João Pedro de Magalhães discusses the challenges in Cryonic. Magalhães is skeptical of Cryonics and hasn't sign up for it. However, Magalhães is open to the possibility and calls it "bridge to the future" . https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d1xHpp4FwbU

For me Cryonics is superior to Mormonism. Cryonics makes much more sense than a zombie apocalypse and the second coming of a hippie. I admit Cryonics is my new wishful thinking, but it brings me hope. I no longer need religion to hope for miracles.

Magalhães argues that we simply "Don't know" the future. No one can really rule out cryonics as a possibility and there is nothing to lose. Magalhães also argues that the future is going to be far better than the present.


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 Post subject: Re: Powerful Presentation by Harvard Microbiologist on Cryon
PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:10 am 
God
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Several years ago, I was a paid consultant for a cryonics "life extension" company in South Florida. They were aware of my skepticism when they brought me on board, but needed someone credentialed to use in their advertising.

Big mistake on my part. (Silly me.)

Scientific reality related to so called cryogenic "life extension" is actually more dismal from the inside than most folks would realize from simply reading about it.

For all intents and purposes, the cryogenic "Life Extension" community does constitute a kind of religion, in that it thrives on unfounded belief in physically impossible events after death. There is a lot more that could be said on the subject, none of it good, but this is probably not the time or place.

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Last edited by DrW on Thu Apr 26, 2018 4:09 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Powerful Presentation by Harvard Microbiologist on Cryon
PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:04 pm 
God

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DrW wrote:
For all intents and purposes, the cryogenic "Life Extension" community does constitute a kind of religion, in that it thrives on unfounded belief in physically impossible events after death. There is a lot more that could be said on the subject, none of it good, but this is probably not the time or place.


I can call it a religion, but I am not convinced it is impossible. Scientists don't know what consciousness is, but as earthworms demonstrate consciousness doesn't have to be complex.

DrW wrote:
There is a lot more that could be said on the subject, none of it good, but this is probably not the time or place.


What do you think about João Pedro de Magalhães presentation? Is he just saying a bunch of nonsense?


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 Post subject: Re: Powerful Presentation by Harvard Microbiologist on Cryon
PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:05 pm 
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DrW wrote:
Several years ago, I was a paid consultant for a cryonics "life extension" company in South Florida. They were aware of my skepticism when they brought me on board, but needed someone credentialed to use in their advertising..


What advice did you give them? Want to know more please


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 Post subject: Re: Powerful Presentation by Harvard Microbiologist on Cryon
PostPosted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 5:33 am 
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DoubtingThomas wrote:
DrW wrote:
Several years ago, I was a paid consultant for a cryonics "life extension" company in South Florida. They were aware of my skepticism when they brought me on board, but needed someone credentialed to use in their advertising..


What advice did you give them? Want to know more please

This may not be such a good idea, but what the hell - it's been a long time and the NDA expired several years ago. To get an idea of what these places (such as Alcor) look like, and how the community thinks, here is the company website.

I was retained along with an experienced heart lung machine technician. The two of us were the only professionals in the group. The rest were all well meaning devotees of a wealthy and rather mysterious guru-like figure in CA, who was funding the entire operation from his estate in the San Bernardino foothills.

The main unfounded belief of cryonic life extension is that, at sometime in the future, technology will have advanced to the point that a properly prepared and preserved dead body could be re-animated, in spite of whatever disease or disorder led to death.

They weren't much interested in mainstream science, or even best clinical practices related to operation of a heart lung machine (used to cool the body and replace the blood with cryopreservation fluid). Long story short, both professionals terminated our relationship with the company in less than a year.

To get into specifics, it would probably be best to move at least that part of the thread to the Spirit Paradise forum. More later if anyone is interested.

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 Post subject: Re: Powerful Presentation by Harvard Microbiologist on Cryon
PostPosted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 9:59 am 
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DrW wrote:
two of us were the only professionals in the group
Panellation...

DrW wrote:
Long story short
:exclaim: Cryonic is - today - only a costly shrine; like Lenin's Mausoleum...
Quote:
Lenin's Mausoleum (formerly Lenin's & Stalin's Mausoleum (1953-1961)) (Russian: Мавзоле́й Ле́нина, tr. Mavzoléy Lénina, IPA: [məvzɐˈlʲej ˈlʲenʲɪnə]), also known as Lenin's Tomb, situated in Red Square in the center of Moscow, is a mausoleum that currently serves as the resting place of Soviet leader Vladimir Lenin. His preserved body has been on public display there since shortly after his death in 1924, with rare exceptions in wartime. Aleksey Shchusev's diminutive but monumental granite structure incorporates some elements from ancient mausoleums, such as the Step Pyramid, the Tomb of Cyrus the Great and, to some degree, Temple of the Inscriptions.

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 Post subject: Re: Powerful Presentation by Harvard Microbiologist on Cryon
PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 4:55 am 
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For DoubtingThomas,

Speaking of the connectome over on The Bell Curve thread, here is an interesting article on Nectome, cryonics and the Alcor crowd.

https://www.livescience.com/62202-mit-nectome-brain-upload.html

Looks as though I'm in good company when saying "no way" to cryonics for humans after spending some time in the field. In spite of the incentive of a paycheck, some of us figured this out ten years ago. A bit surprised that MIT would get drawn into such an undertaking in the first place - but there you are.

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DrW: "Mistakes in science are learning opportunities and are eventually corrected."


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 Post subject: Re: Powerful Presentation by Harvard Microbiologist on Cryon
PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 10:23 pm 
God

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DrW wrote:
For DoubtingThomas,

Speaking of the connectome over on The Bell Curve thread, here is an interesting article on Nectome, cryonics and the Alcor crowd.

https://www.livescience.com/62202-mit-nectome-brain-upload.html

Looks as though I'm in good company when saying "no way" to cryonics for humans after spending some time in the field. In spite of the incentive of a paycheck, some of us figured this out ten years ago. A bit surprised that MIT would get drawn into such an undertaking in the first place - but there you are.

Very interesting DrW. I have a lot of thinking to do. Thanks. But 90% of Americans believe a zombie god is somehow three in one. I think Cryonics is less crazier than Christianity and Mormonism.


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 Post subject: Re: Powerful Presentation by Harvard Microbiologist on Cryon
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2018 4:36 am 
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DoubtingThomas wrote:
DrW wrote:
For DoubtingThomas,

Speaking of the connectome over on The Bell Curve thread, here is an interesting article on Nectome, cryonics and the Alcor crowd.

https://www.livescience.com/62202-mit-nectome-brain-upload.html

Looks as though I'm in good company when saying "no way" to cryonics for humans after spending some time in the field. In spite of the incentive of a paycheck, some of us figured this out ten years ago. A bit surprised that MIT would get drawn into such an undertaking in the first place - but there you are.

Very interesting DrW. I have a lot of thinking to do. Thanks. But 90% of Americans believe a zombie god is somehow three in one. I think Cryonics is less crazier than Christianity and Mormonism.

DoubtingThomas,

No argument from me on that point. Cryonics seems to me to be based on a gross overestimation of what science and bioengineering can accomplish. As far as I can see, however, its basic tenets do not violate the fundamental laws of physics (although they do great violence to chemistry and biology itself).

In contrast, the basic beliefs of Christianity and Mormonism absolutely run counter to the fundamental laws of physics. They do more than overestimate the bounds of science - they seem to ignore them altogether.

In former times this stemmed from ignorance. Nowadays it seems to stem more from intellectual laziness and delusion.

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DrW: "Mistakes in science are learning opportunities and are eventually corrected."


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 Post subject: Re: Powerful Presentation by Harvard Microbiologist on Cryon
PostPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 9:48 pm 
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DrW wrote:

DoubtingThomas,

No argument from me on that point. Cryonics seems to me to be based on a gross overestimation of what science and bioengineering can accomplish. As far as I can see, however, its basic tenets do not violate the fundamental laws of physics


Well, that makes me feel a little better. It's just my human need to believe in something.


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