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 Post subject: Re: Sgt Nibley-another Paul Dunn?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 26, 2017 11:28 am 
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Any Mormon who reads this thread should feel a hot embarrassment by Nibley's stolen valor and the Church's exploitation of an utterly horrific moment. These guys are stealing honor, honor earned by men who actually paid the ultimate price:

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https://sites.lib.BYU.edu/nibley/journal/

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I asked Nibley about June 6 D-Day. He then animatedly began to tell me about not being put on the glider that ended up crashing, instead driving General Pratt’s jeep ashore to Utah Beach, and then hiding out later in a French farmhouse.


eta: Let's just say he was driving the Genera'sl Jeep onto the beach, he certainly wouldn't be in the 1st few assault waves, driving the General's Jeep. Ugh. This is ridiculous.

- Doc


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 Post subject: Re: Sgt Nibley-another Paul Dunn?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 26, 2017 11:42 am 
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Good stuff here:

Quote:
Once while he was sitting in his tent, a 16-inch shell landed in the mud a few yards away from him and slid along until it stopped, without exploding, its nose touching his tent.


This has to be the most Forrest Gump mother ____ er I've ever read about.

Quote:
Before the Battle of the Bulge, as he was climbing into a Jeep headed for the Ardennes, he was pulled out and sent to Le Vesinet—all the Jeep's occupants were killed.


So, that makes miracle #1) a glider he should've been on where all the occupants were killed, miracle #2) drove a Jeep underwater (TWO FEET UNDER WATER) with 12 Soldiers hanging on and the Jeep ahead of him on Utah beach was blown up, miracle #3) another Jeep he should've been on where all the occupants were killed, miracle #4) another glider where he took fire thanks to armor that just happened to be laying about (GUESS THEY DIDN'T HAVE LOAD MASTERS BACK THEN).

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I learned that Hugh had spent many hours conducting maneuvers at Antietam battlefield during World War II while he was stationed at Camp Ritchie


WHAT?

- Doc


Last edited by Doctor CamNC4Me on Tue Dec 26, 2017 5:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Sgt Nibley-another Paul Dunn?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 26, 2017 12:03 pm 
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Doctor CamNC4Me wrote:
Good stuff here:

Quote:
Once while he was sitting in his tent, a 16-inch shell landed in the mud a few yards away from him and slid along until it stopped, without exploding, its nose touching his tent.


This has to be the most Forrest Gump mother ____ er I've ever read about.

- Doc


The only 16 inch artillery that the Germans even had during WWII was the 40.6 cm SK C/34 "Adolfkanone" (Adolf cannon). It was originally designed for use on large battleships and was also used for coastal defense along the Atlantic Wall (as shown below).

Image

If a shell from one of these things ended up in beside HN's tent, that means that the enemy went to the Atlantic Wall, removed the mounting restraints for the 1,400 + ton gun, got ahold of a gun crew of at least two dozen men, somehow commandeered a crane to lift and rotate the muzzle of the 1,400 ton + weapon to point inland, loaded a dud round, and then fired the thing at HN's tent - and missed.

Give me strength.

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DrW: "Mistakes in science are learning opportunities and are eventually corrected."


Last edited by DrW on Tue Dec 26, 2017 12:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Sgt Nibley-another Paul Dunn?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 26, 2017 12:11 pm 
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Methinks the General Staff's driver might've trumped up his service a bit...

- Doc


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 Post subject: Re: Sgt Nibley-another Paul Dunn?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 26, 2017 1:52 pm 
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Doctor CamNC4Me wrote:
Methinks the General Staff's driver might've trumped up his service a bit...

- Doc

Just a quick note from a very brief career as an 8 inch (M110) howitzer gunner for those who may not be familiar with artillery or with ballistics in general.

Large bore, long range guns such as the 16 inch Adolf Cannon can throw projectiles weighing a ton or so more than 20 miles. To do this, they might need to elevate the angle of their gun tubes to 50 degrees or more from the horizontal.

A projectile that is fired at an angle of, say, 50 degrees to the horizontal is going to impact in the target area at an angle to the horizontal equal to or greater than that at which it was launched - so probably greater than 50 degrees.

What are the chances that a cylindrical projectile with a conical nose fuse coming in at that angle is going to 'slide across the mud' upon impact? None whatsoever.

If it does not explode (a very low probability outcome), the shell would make a crater and bury itself, at least partially, into muddy ground upon impact. It would not magically rotate itself (and its momentum vector), to the horizontal seconds before impact and "slip" or "slide" anywhere.

If one is going to make up tall tales, at last give the audience some credit. This kind of nonsense from HN is just embarrassing.

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DrW: "Mistakes in science are learning opportunities and are eventually corrected."


Last edited by DrW on Tue Dec 26, 2017 2:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Sgt Nibley-another Paul Dunn?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 26, 2017 2:11 pm 
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Doc and DrW, hope you are gathering citations for this. I think it just might be the nuking of the Nibley myth. :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: Sgt Nibley-another Paul Dunn?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 26, 2017 2:17 pm 
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Are you ____ ing kidding me with this bull ____?

http://www.meethinks.net/2015/07/26/a-w ... r-2-story/

Quote:
(Pgs 133-136) As remembered by Hugh Nibley in an interview with his son Alex, who helped write the book:

Once we were in Carentan, the division set up headquarters by the canal that ran through the town. There was a brick building, a factory, there, and we saw a man looking out of the window. The Germans had cleared out of the building, but there was somebody peeking out the upper window seeing what was going on below. Somebody was observing us. Well, Major Danahy (now Colonel Danahy they’d made him) says, “Go up and see who that is.” So Dave Bernay and some others went to look, and they brought a guy down. He was dressed in civilian clothes, but he spoke German, so Colonel Danahy said, “Take that man out and shoot him,” and he assigned that to Dave Bernay. Well, Dave had done plenty of killing and he hated Nazis, so this was not a particularly tough assignment for him. He put his gun over his shoulder and said, “Come along, let’s get going,” and took the prisoner out across the fields. They came to a drainage ditch with a little water in it and Dave says, “Step over the ditch,” in German: “Eibe dein fluss.” “Ah, you speak German?” the prisoner says. Obviously the guy wanted to stall as long as possible. He saw this guy was going to shoot him, and he wanted to make friends with him, do something. I would certainly start talking, especially if the soldier spoke German. So they struck up a conversation. Dave says, “Yes, I speak German.” “Where are you from?” “I’m from Maxmiliansau,” Dave said.

Now Nibley describes the village (he served a mission in Germany): The village of Maxmliansau was hardly more than one factory on the Rhine where they made celluloid out of pine logs. When I was a missionary you’d find rafts of pine logs floating down the river, and you could get on and paddle across on them. Those came from the celluloid factory at Maxmiliansau. That was all there was to the town – not many people lived there, it was just a factory.

Back to the story: “Maxmiliansau?” the prisoner said. “Did you know Herr Bernay?” “He was my father,” Dave said. And the man looked at him and he said, “My little David!” and he threw his arms around him and took him in a fond embrace. It turned out this was the guy who got the Bernay family out of Germany and saved their lives! Dave’s father was the one who managed the factory, and this man was the Bernay house-servant. He had helped them escape the Nazis and saved their lives. He had been a laborer in the camp by Carentan, and the reason he had stayed behind to spy was because he wanted to desert to us, he was waiting there to give himself up. Dave told about it later and he just wept like a fish. “My little David!” That was a close call. Instead of shooting him, they took the guy and gave him a job working in the kitchen.


WHAT?? Nibley just accused his commanding Officer of committing a war crime. WHAT. And on top of that we have an incredible coincidence that only Liam Neeson could've portrayed better.

Make this MIRACLE NUMBER SIX.

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- Doc


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 Post subject: Re: Sgt Nibley-another Paul Dunn?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 26, 2017 2:44 pm 
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hugh_Nibley

Whoever wrote his wiki page claims he was a Master Sergeant. That'd be an interesting rate of promotion for him. I guess we'll find out when I get his personnel file:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_ ... ted_States)

- Doc


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 Post subject: Re: Sgt Nibley-another Paul Dunn?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 26, 2017 2:49 pm 
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https://www.deilataylor.com/hugh-nibley-humor/

Here's another Nibley tale of scrubbing food for Officers with a dirty toilet brush on Thanksgiving Eve:

Quote:
My first assignment — it was so typically Army you must hear about it: It was the eve of Thanksgiving, and I was scrubbing toilets out with a big brush, with a big scrubbing brush. I was busy scrubbing these latrines out and so forth, and an officer came to me and said, “come with me and bring the brush.”

So I said, “come with me and bring the brush.”

It was a huge pile of celery, they were preparing it for the officer’s mess the next day.

He says, “clean this celery off.”

But I said, “but this brush, I just used it for cleaning toilets…”

“That doesn’t make any difference, if it looks shiny and clean, that’s the Army, that’s all we want to know.”

So there I was cleaning that celery for the officers the next day for their Thanksgiving dinner with a toilet brush. That’s so typically Army. I mean it’s marvelous, you know, and it just goes on. (Faith of an Observer)


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 Post subject: Re: Sgt Nibley-another Paul Dunn?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 26, 2017 2:55 pm 
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Here's Plagiarizin' Peterson endorsing Nibley's Amazin' Exploits:

https://ldsmag.com/article-1-1943/

Quote:
Instead, we see Nibley the combat soldier – unlike most soldiers in most wars, he really did fire his weapon in battle


In addition to coming face to face with Hitler, did you know Nibley:

Quote:
Nibley was able to spend considerable time with Grand Duke Vladimir Kirillovitch Romanoff, the head of the exiled Russian imperial family. He also believed that he caught a late glimpse of Martin Bormann, the highest ranking Nazi leader whose postwar fate remains obscure. Unfortunately, though, whoever the man was, he eluded Nibley’s attempt to capture him.


Dude. Holy cow. This guy was a pathological liar, and also apparently saw ghosts!

Quote:
his seeming encounters with apparitions of the president of Claremont College and of his beloved grandmother immediately after their deaths – the latter when he was in a foxhole in Holland


This is the guy Mormons have elevated to some sort of spiritual and intellectual giant. I dunno. I mean. This is some Joseph Smith level of bull ____ ting. Ugh. Ridiculous.

- Doc


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 Post subject: Re: Sgt Nibley-another Paul Dunn?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 26, 2017 3:02 pm 
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WHAT?

https://deseretbook.com/p/sergeant-nibl ... 8909-ebook

Quote:
General Maxwell Taylor assigned Sergeant Nibley to educate the officers of the 101st Airborne about warfare.


- Doc


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 Post subject: Re: Sgt Nibley-another Paul Dunn?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 26, 2017 3:12 pm 
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It will be interesting to see his war record or a pix of the nibster after war to see if he wears the CIB -combat infantryman badge ;i think he having engaged the german enemy with his rifle and fired it at them and took fire, ,even as an intel specialist he would be awarded that badge-am i correct?


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 Post subject: Re: Sgt Nibley-another Paul Dunn?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 26, 2017 3:18 pm 
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Doctor CamNC4Me wrote:
WHAT?

https://deseretbook.com/p/sergeant-nibl ... 8909-ebook

Quote:
General Maxwell Taylor assigned Sergeant Nibley to educate the officers of the 101st Airborne about warfare.


- Doc


Nibley showed the 101st how to do it. This is bigger horseschitz than Joseph Smith. Just wow. :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Sgt Nibley-another Paul Dunn?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 26, 2017 3:19 pm 
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https://scholarsarchive.BYU.edu/cgi/vie ... text=byusq

WHAT.

Quote:
Nibley was in the thick of it all: he distinguished himself in advanced intelligence, helping to write Invademecum [sic], a top-secret guide used in the invasion of Normandy


- Doc


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 Post subject: Re: Sgt Nibley-another Paul Dunn?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 26, 2017 3:23 pm 
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http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/ ... e-booklet/

One of the posters from the forum above:

"It should be noted that these are BRITISH products. They were sized to fit into the thigh pocket on Battle Dress trousers.

And in a display of British wit, the title is taken from the Latin terminology for a tour guide (in pre-war civilian life), which was "Vade Mecum" (Come with me). "

I expect that the Nibleyists will claim that the classified nature of Nibley's activities, along with the fog of war and the buffetings of Satan, will account for all discrepancies. :wink:

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Last edited by Maksutov on Tue Dec 26, 2017 3:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Sgt Nibley-another Paul Dunn?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 26, 2017 3:25 pm 
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kairos wrote:
It will be interesting to see his war record or a pix of the nibster after war to see if he wears the CIB -combat infantryman badge ;i think he having engaged the german enemy with his rifle and fired it at them and took fire, ,even as an intel specialist he would be awarded that badge-am i correct?


I don't believe that's the case hence why the Combat Action Badge was created. I'm not really sure if non-Infantry assigned to an Infantry unit who saw action received one. My impression is that's not the case.

- Doc


Last edited by Doctor CamNC4Me on Tue Dec 26, 2017 4:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Sgt Nibley-another Paul Dunn?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 26, 2017 3:41 pm 
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Image

That's the Army Air Force(s) branch insignia, by the way:

Image

The fact that he's never referred to as having served in the Counterintelligence Corps (CIC) raises a huge red flag for me. The CIC was designed to specifically use people who had investigative and linguistic skills that would help serve the Intelligence apparatus in either the European or Japanese theater.

I find it really odd that he's wearing Army Air insignia, but maybe... Maybe the CIC didn't have a branch insignia they would wear, although that would be odd. I would imagine it would've been the old MI insignia (before the Battlestar Galactica one) or the crossed pistols for Military Police (since they were considered investigative in nature).

I don't know. Something isn't right with him wearing Army Air insignia, yet conducting CIC operations.

eta: He also would've had a set of Badge & Credentials. I find it almost impossible to believe he wouldn't have held onto them along with his diaries and related military service items.

Image

- Doc


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 Post subject: Re: Sgt Nibley-another Paul Dunn?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 26, 2017 4:58 pm 
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Also, why wouldn't the Army commission a Ph.D. who had a direct skill related to its Intelligence mission during WWII? This is baffling to me.

- Doc


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 Post subject: Re: Sgt Nibley-another Paul Dunn?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 26, 2017 5:07 pm 
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Maksutov wrote:
http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/57478-d-day-invasion-officers-intelligence-booklet/

One of the posters from the forum above:

"It should be noted that these are BRITISH products. They were sized to fit into the thigh pocket on Battle Dress trousers.

And in a display of British wit, the title is taken from the Latin terminology for a tour guide (in pre-war civilian life), which was "Vade Mecum" (Come with me). "

I expect that the Nibleyists will claim that the classified nature of Nibley's activities, along with the fog of war and the buffetings of Satan, will account for all discrepancies. :wink:

Maks,

His German wasn't much better than his Latin. “Eibe dein fluss" is definitely not German for "Step over the ditch". Not even close. This passage translates to "Yew your flow" in English.

I've been trying to figure out what it perhaps should have been, but its not even close to anything that makes sense.

"Step over the ditch" translates to "Tritt über den Graben" in German. The noun Fluss in German refers to flowing water usually a river. In German, "fluss" with a lower case "f" is not even a word. The word "flussig" refers to a liquid or some thing flowing or in flux. my wife is a native German speaker and agrees that the sentence makes no sense in German.

If it was a stream or a creek and he was told to jump, then; "Springen über den Strom" or "Springen über den Bach", respectively.

Bottom line; this is just more nonsense. One would have thought that a book editor, (if, in fact, there was one) would have checked the claimed German language passage with a dictionary to see if at least the words themselves made sense, let alone the grammar.

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DrW: "Mistakes in science are learning opportunities and are eventually corrected."


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 Post subject: Re: Sgt Nibley-another Paul Dunn?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 26, 2017 5:15 pm 
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DrW wrote:
Maksutov wrote:
http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/57478-d-day-invasion-officers-intelligence-booklet/

One of the posters from the forum above:

"It should be noted that these are BRITISH products. They were sized to fit into the thigh pocket on Battle Dress trousers.

And in a display of British wit, the title is taken from the Latin terminology for a tour guide (in pre-war civilian life), which was "Vade Mecum" (Come with me). "

I expect that the Nibleyists will claim that the classified nature of Nibley's activities, along with the fog of war and the buffetings of Satan, will account for all discrepancies. :wink:

Maks,

His German wasn't much better than his Latin. “Eibe dein fluss" is definitely not German for "Step over the ditch". Not even close. This passage translates to "Yew your flow" in English.

I've been trying to figure out what it perhaps should have been, but its not even close to anything that makes sense.

"Step over the ditch" translates to "Tritt über den Graben" in German. The noun Fluss in German refers to flowing water usually a river. In German, "fluss" with a lower case "f" is not even a word. The word "flussig" refers to a liquid or some thing flowing or in flux. my wife is a native German speaker and agrees that the sentence makes no sense in German.

If it was a stream or a creek and he was told to jump, then; "Springen über den Strom" or "Springen über den Bach", respectively.

Bottom line; this is just more nonsense. One would have thought that a book editor, (if, in fact, there was one) would have checked the claimed German language passage with a dictionary to see if at least the words themselves made sense, let alone the grammar.


Oh dear. It seems like we might be seeing an autopsy of the legacy of the great Hugh.

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 Post subject: Re: Sgt Nibley-another Paul Dunn?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 26, 2017 5:17 pm 
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Quote:
Bottom line; this is just more nonsense.

I think DrW's comment sums it up. And speaking of nonsense, is someone messing with Wikipedia or is the part I highlighted below factual?
Quote:
Books about Nibley[edit]
Sergeant Nibley, Ph.D.: Memories of an Unlikely Screaming Eagle. A memoir of Nibley's World War II experiences, published in the fall of 2006 by Deseret Book. It is bylined "Hugh Nibley and Alex Nibley," and reflects Nibley's experiences, written and redacted by his son Alex.


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