Dr. Shades wrote:Ray A wrote:He wouldn't be the first, that I can assure you.
WHAT???
You can't actually be serious that other people have thought of it, too? You were a bishop once, so you're in the perfect position to know: Did you ever encounter this? If so, did you encounter any other creative ways of claiming to be a full tithepayer, and if so, what were they?
Shades, there's no way a bishop can know how much a member has earned, except in cases such as outlined by MM. Most bishops aren't going to be doing estimates either. We discussed this at some length on your old MDB, so I won't go into much more detail. Let me say that I have encountered some people whose declarations were very suspicious. I am sure many had investments, shares, and other sources of income also which went undeclared. I also knew a member who did casual jobs for cash in hand, apart from his real job, and he didn't declare that to the taxation office. He told me so (I wasn't a bishop then). I very much doubt he paid tithing on that. Remember, tithing is
income, no matter where the source. In that regard I suspect
most members do not pay a full tithe. Perhaps I exaggerate a bit with your analogy above, but from my experience most members only paid tithes on work income. Then there were the unemployed or those receiving income from the government, for example for family allowance, pensions, disability payments, etc. , and a bishop can't keep track of all this either. There are mothers who receive income for children, like $150 a month, say, do you think most of them are going to take out $15 of money going to their children?
And as I said before, every bishop is different. I was not one to be interrogating people. I simply asked them the question, and recorded the answer. If they wanted to risk their celestial ass, as far as I was concerned that's their business.
Here is what the CHI says:
All members should attend tithing settlement to make sure their contribution records are correct and to declare to the bishop their status as tithe payers. AR members of a family should attend tithing settlement. In addition to reviewing the members' tithing records, during tithing settlement the bishop can discuss the principle of tithing with them, encourage them to give a generous fast offering, and discuss other relevant matters.
And:
The Church normally discourages paying tithing in kind. It is preferable for members to dispose of the property themselves and then pay tithing in cash. However, the payment of tithing in kind may be accepted in certain cases and may be a common practice in some areas of the world.
That is all they have to do, they don't have to prove anything. And do you think any bishop can keep track of members' sales or investment profits throughout the year? He'd need a few STC members tracking everyone.